DVP vs. DiEUGENIO
(PART 23)


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

James DiEugenio continues to do the thing that conspiracy-loving kooks
do best. They (and he) keep resurrecting already trashed theories, and
then they (he) apparently hope that nobody remembers that each of these
stupid theories has already been thoroughly explained in non-conspiratorial
ways.

As many conspiracy theorists try to do, DiEugenio also tries to maneuver
and re-work the Zapruder film's head-shot sequence into a "Conspiracy Only"
type of framework.

But what DiEugenio specifically does in his anti-Bugliosi review (and
during his frequent appearances on "Black Op Radio") is pathetic and
reprehensible, IMO.

It's actually kind of a triple-bill of absurdity and distortion on Jim's
part, too. Here's the "triple-bill" I'm referring to:

1.) DiEugenio has the gall to imply that JFK's head is in the
"exact position" in Z-Frame 313 as it was 1/18th of a second earlier
in Z312....which is total rubbish, of course. And DiEugenio has got to
know it's rubbish, too, because we know he's seen the Z-Film
IN MOTION many, many times in his life.

Therefore, since we know Jim's seen the film many times (and
undoubtedly has viewed frames 312 and 313 in super slow-motion,
like all of us have done many, many times, such as the clip provided
below) -- then we know that Jim doesn't have a leg to stand on when
he said to the sparse "Black Op Radio" audience that JFK's head is in
the "exact position" in Z313 as it was in Z312.



Also -- When DiEugenio said those words ["exact position"] on
Black Op Radio on November 27, 2008, he prefaced the remark by
misrepresenting Vince Bugliosi's REASON for putting a picture in his
book of the "high contrast" picture of Z313, with Jim, for some stupid
reason, saying that Vince uses that high-contrast version of Z313 to
show that the President's head is "leaning forward" at the moment of
the head shot.

Of course, as anyone can easily see by reading page 486 of VB's 2007
book, "Reclaiming History" (which is, indeed, the exact page number
cited by DiEugenio when Jim discusses this topic in Part 4 of his "RH"
review on Jim's website), Bugliosi is certainly NOT talking about the
forward lean or tilt of Kennedy's head when VB refers to the high-
contrast photo of Z313.

Vince, instead, utilizes the high-contrast picture to emphasize the
fact that all of the blood and brain tissue is seen to the FRONT of
JFK's head, indicating (of course) the likelihood that the bullet that
just caused that terrible spray of bodily fluid came from BEHIND the
President.

For DiEugenio to totally misrepresent Mr. Bugliosi with regard to this
important matter is, IMO, just about as disingenuous (and sneaky) as
you can get.

And Jim's "exact position" remark is just flat-out dead-wrong too, as
we all know. And even if Jim wanted to come back with the argument
that he was ONLY talking about the degree of "lean" or "tilt" of JFK's
head in both Z312 and Z313, his argument wouldn't go very far either.

Because even THAT argument would be invalid, because when JFK's head
moves forward between 312 and 313, the "forward lean" of his head DOES
change slightly too (i.e., in Z313, Kennedy's head can certainly not be
said to be in the "exact position" it was in in Z312...even from JUST
a "leaning forward" standpoint).

But it was obvious to me that DiEugenio's distortions (and his
misrepresentations of what Bugliosi meant by certain things relating
to Z-frames 312 and 313) are part of a concerted effort on his part to
try and REMOVE (or just DENY) as much of the verified Z-Film evidence
that exists that tells a reasonable person that JFK was shot FROM
BEHIND at the important moment when the bullet struck him at Z313.
And numbers 2 and 3 below go toward meeting that desired goal of
Jim's as well.


2.) DiEugenio's comment about how it looks like only "the front" part
of JFK's head is "being impacted" at Z313 is a real "WTF?" moment.

Jim must think that an ENTRY hole for a bullet is the HUGE hole, vs.
EXIT holes being the large and irregular-shaped ones.

Unbelievable.

And, again, as with Jim's distortions in #1, this #2 item is designed
to re-write the history of this murder, as James tries to impress upon
people something that is just plain dumb -- that is, that the great-big
hole at the right-front of JFK's head was the "impact" (or entry) point
for an incoming bullet fired from the front.

How stupid does Jim think his listeners are? Granted, a lot of conspiracy
kooks are mighty stupid....but geez.


3.) With Black Op host Len Osanic's help (it was Osanic who first
mentioned this #3 item, with DiEugenio, right on cue it would seem,
jumping in with both feet firmly in his mouth to completely agree with
the incredibly wrong thing that Len just uttered), DiEugenio actually
had the additional audacity to suggest that both of the Connallys
(John and Nellie) WEREN'T splattered with debris from the fatal shot
that struck JFK in the head.

Talk about misleading people. This one is a beaut in that regard.

Of course, as virtually all JFK researchers know (without even having
to think about it and without even needing to look up any of Nellie's
or JBC's testimony), both John and Nellie Connally were definitely
"covered" with debris from the fatal gunshot that hit JFK's head. To
quote John Connally himself:

"I could see blood and brain tissue all over the interior of the
car and all over our clothes. We were both covered with brain tissue."
-- JOHN B. CONNALLY; 1978 HSCA TESTIMONY

So, we can see from the above three points that James DiEugenio (like
many other conspiracists) is practically DESPERATE to re-write the history
of this assassination.

And while he's attempting to re-write history, Jim is obviously willing to
just toss the testimony of both John Connally and Nellie Connally out
the nearest window (and I don't believe for one second that DiEugenio
could have possibly gone this long without hearing at least ONE of the
many, many interviews [or WC/HSCA sessions] with the Connallys, where
they each have stated many times that they were splattered and "covered"
with JFK's brains and blood).

When I hear a CTer like Jim DiEugenio make blatantly incorrect remarks
like he has done on multiple recent Black Op Radio shows, I have to ask
the following question:

Since Jim is perfectly willing to totally misrepresent and mangle
certain KNOWN FACTS regarding the assassination of President Kennedy,
then why in the world would anyone take seriously anything else he
might say about a "conspiracy" in the JFK case?

David Von Pein
December 2008


================================


A RELATED DISCUSSION, YEARS LATER....

JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

Here is another instance that [Gerry] Spence let go by [at the 1986 mock Oswald trial]....

If you can believe it, Bugliosi had his photo expert Cecil Kirk testify on a medical matter. He had Kirk testify that because the Z film depicts JFK slightly tilted forward at Z 313, and the head burst appears to go straight up at that point, this means that the bullet entered from behind.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

What in the heck are you talking about? Cecil Kirk didn't testify about any "medical matter" at all. He testified only about things relating to photo interpretation. Why Jim DiEugenio is saying otherwise is a mystery.

In addition, Kirk didn't say a single word about JFK's head being "tilted forward" at the time of the head shot. Not a word. And neither did Bugliosi. They did, however, talk about how President Kennedy's head was seen by Kirk and the rest of the HSCA's Photographic Panel to move slightly FORWARD an instant after the bullet struck JFK in the head. Here is that testimony:


VINCENT BUGLIOSI -- "In addition to the spray of brain matter--all to the front--do frames 313 and 314 [of the Zapruder Film] actually show the President's head being pushed forward slightly by the momentum of the bullet?"

CECIL KIRK -- "Yes, it does."


Kirk's testimony at the 1986 mock trial can be seen below. And we can easily see that Kirk is not testifying about any "medical matter" at all. His testimony deals only with photo and film interpretation.* (And, btw, I did, indeed, check every reference to "Cecil Kirk" in my searchable PDF version of Bugliosi's book, "Reclaiming History", because I know there are a lot of excerpts used by Mr. Bugliosi from the over 1,000 pages of the transcript for the '86 mock trial, with many of those excerpts and witness quotes not showing up when the trial was shown on television in 1986 and again in 1988. But I did not find any references in Vince's book to Kirk testifying to any "medical matters" at all. He only talked about matters of photo interpretation.)

* And it would certainly seem as if Cecil Kirk was definitely qualified to interpret the photos and films in the JFK murder case, including the interpretation (from the standpoint of a photographic expert only, not as a "medical" expert) of what it means when we see all that spray of blood and brain tissue coming out the front of the President's head just after Zapruder frame #313.**

Here's what Vince Bugliosi had to say about Cecil Kirk's qualifications as a photographic expert:

"Kirk had been the sergeant who headed the Mobile Crime Lab and Photographic Services Unit for the Metropolitan Police Department of the District of Columbia. This unit was responsible for the preparation of the photographic exhibits for the HSCA hearings and final report. .... Kirk, considered one of the nation's leading experts in forensic photography and forensic crime-scene technology, and a former lecturer on forensic crime photography at the FBI Academy, was now [in May of 1986] director of the Support Services Bureau for the Scottsdale Police Department." -- Vincent Bugliosi; Pages 485-486 of "Reclaiming History"

** But despite Kirk's qualifications, I strongly disagree with him and the HSCA Photo Panel's conclusion regarding the timing of the "Single-Bullet Theory" gunshot. More on that here.





JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

Anyone can read Bugliosi's book on this, which DVP apparently has done.

He and Kirk decided that because the Z film shows Kennedy's head tilted slightly forward at the moment of impact and the spray is slightly forward then the impact came from behind.

It is utter flatulence on Davey's part for him to deny that Bugliosi and Kirk made a big deal of this. Just look in the door stop, i.e. Bugliosi's book, on page 486. He actually compares its visual effect with the Zapruder film head snap!

He then says that "...it shows vivid, graphic evidence that the fatal shot to the head at Z 312-313 was fired from the rear." And he bases this on the head burst. Bugliosi plays this up like Archimedes and his eureka moment. Anyone can read this and the following page for themselves. I am not at all exaggerating. Davey either forgot it or he is trying to discount it, because clearly Kirk and Bugliosi were not informed about DeMaio [sic] and cavitation. In fact, I could not find the word cavitation in the index for RH. And whatever one thinks of the door stop, it has a good index.

That is the reason the head burst appears as it does. Nothing to do with directionality. Bullet comes in the front, same cavitation phenomenon.

Spence could have nailed them both on this.

BTW, I am not done with Kirk. (Has anyone read Reclaiming Parkland? I guess Davey has not. For good reason.)


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Jim,

Why are you continuing to misrepresent some of the things that Vince Bugliosi has said? As I pointed out to you in December of 2008 [above] and again yesterday [March 9, 2017], NOWHERE within Bugliosi's arguments (either in his book on page 486 or at the 1986 mock trial) does he even mention the fact that JFK's head is "tilted forward". That is NOT part of Vincent's argument at all. Nor was it part of Cecil Kirk's argument either.

In addition....

Let me also add the following pertinent quotes that appear in Vince Bugliosi's book, which include some very important points made by Mr. Bugliosi that should be ADDED TO THE SUM TOTAL of all the other evidence in the case, which is a "sum total" that will inexorably lead a reasonable person to the only possible conclusion he could reach regarding the directionality of the fatal head shot, with that conclusion being: that fatal shot came from BEHIND the President (which is a conclusion that conspiracy theorists like James DiEugenio want to stay away from like it was the plague). And keep in mind, these quotes below from Bugliosi's book don't even touch on the VERY BEST evidence we have to prove beyond all possible doubt that the fatal shot to JFK's head came from behind---the autopsy photos and X-rays and the autopsy report. ....


"As can be clearly seen, the terrible spray of blood, shell fragments, and brain matter a millisecond after the president was shot appears to be to the front. .... And indeed, from Governor Connally's wife, we know that the shot to the president's head caused "brain tissue" to land on "both of us" (she and her husband), each of whom was seated in front of the president (4 H 147). .... Not only were the blood, brain tissue, and skull fragments all blown to the front of the president's body, but the five bullet fragments found in the presidential limousine were all to his front. .... Also, the three skull fragments found inside the limousine were all to the president's front. .... The main argument from conspiracy theorists that the "law of physics" requires that an object hit by a projectile has to be pushed in the direction the projectile is traveling, and therefore, the head snap to the rear compels the conclusion of a shot from the front, can easily be used against them. In addition to the fact that the president's head moved forward at the moment of impact, how do the conspiracists explain what would be the ridiculous anomaly of blood, brain tissue, three skull fragments, and five bullet fragments all flying to the front of the president's body at the same precise time they claim Kennedy's head was being propelled backward by a shot from the front? They don't. And can't." -- Vincent Bugliosi; Page 486 of "Reclaiming History"


JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

More baloney.

Davey evidently could not pull back one page. On page 485 is where VB makes his big argument about the head tilted forward and downward.

IN THE VERY NEXT PARAGRAPH IS WHERE HE INTRODUCES KIRK AND THE PHOTOS!

One paragraph after that is when VB has his eureka moment about his (false) conclusion concerning the directionality of the head shot and bloodburst. And he specifically mentions the position of JFK's head. It's in the last paragraph on that page.

This, of course, is a non sequitur based on the forensic work of DiMaio. And only a layman like Bugliosi and a photo man with no expertise in forensic medicine, but with a matching agenda to his, like Kirk, would go for it.

VB does not reveal on those pages the fact that Kirk worked for the WC. He was only 25 at the time. (Reclaiming Parkland, p. 59)


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Dead wrong (as usual). There isn't a single thing on page 485 where Bugliosi makes any mention of the President's head being "tilted forward". So why are you making this up, Jim?

You seem to be confusing Bugliosi's argument about JFK's head MOVING FORWARD (or being PUSHED FORWARD by the impact of Oswald's bullet) with your terminology when you repeatedly use the words "TILTED FORWARD".

Do you really mean "pushed" or "moved" when you say "tilted", Jim? If so, you shouldn't be using the word "tilted", because it's not a word used by either Bugliosi or Kirk in their arguments about the direction JFK's head moves at the moment of impact at Z313. "Tilted" does not necessarily imply "Movement".

Plus, you aren't actually going to DENY that JFK's head DOES, indeed, MOVE FORWARD between Z312 and Z313, are you Jimmy?

EDIT -- I realize now, after thinking about it for a few more minutes, that DiEugenio HAS in the past (in 2008) actually denied the obvious forward movement of President Kennedy's head between frames 312 and 313. You can hear him denying this undeniable fact in the radio interview below:




JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

PS Uh Davey, was not most of the blood in the back seat? I mean is that not where the SS man at Parkland was wiping up? According to VB, none of it should have been there.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

How incredibly silly of you to say something so utterly ridiculous. Vincent Bugliosi never said (or even remotely implied) that there shouldn't have been a large amount of blood in the back seat of the limousine. Vince knew that JFK remained inside the car, bleeding profusely, for at least five minutes after being shot. So, of course a lot of blood was going to be present in the back seat of the car.

Vince never suggested that every last drop of blood in Kennedy's whole body should have been propelled forward at the moment of the bullet's impact. So why are you suggesting that Vince DID suggest such a ludicrous thing, Jim?


JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

Davey, this is really below even you.

On page 485, Bugliosi spends five paragraphs, and part of some excerpted dialogue from the CBS special explaining the head tilted forward that Tink Thompson talked about way back in 1967.

Right after those five paragraphs--in fact in the next paragraph--he says he drove to see Kirk in Arizona. IN THAT SAME PARAGRAPH HE TALKS ABOUT HIS SHOCK WHEN HE SAW THE PHOTO ON KIRK'S DINING ROOM TABLE!

Do I have to quote the reaction: "Five or so minutes into my necessarily indiscriminate perusal of the photographs, one photograph suddenly stood out, startlingly so."

And that is the pic he is talking about, the high contrast 313. He puts both in his photo section, the regular z film plus the high contrast. And he says that this proves the fatal impact came from the rear. Because of the reasons I stated above. And it's completely false, since cavitation is non directional. Davey, I know this book better than you do. I wrote a 400-page critique of it and I took over 75 pages of notes while doing so.

Now, let me add, Tink Thompson, who is given credit for this discovery--although Ray Marcus found it earlier--does not believe it anymore. Based on the work of Daryl Weatherly, he thinks today that this is part of a smear on the film. And he argued this at the Duquesne seminar in 2013. This will be a big part of his new book, One Second in Dallas. As will be the idea that Z 312-313 was not the final shot.

Let me add: if Tink is right about this, then it's pretty much all over. (For people like me it was over a long time ago, but this will be more dirt on the casket.)

And Bugliosi looks even more like a court jester than I described in my book. Which is kind of sad, since I liked Vince. Until I read the door stop.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

I guess I'll just have to get accustomed to Jim DiEugenio meaning "PUSHED FORWARD" whenever he says "TILTED FORWARD" when referring to what Vincent Bugliosi was actually talking about on pages 485 and 486 of "Reclaiming History". ~shrug~

And, quite naturally, as he should have done in his book and at the 1986 mock trial with Cecil Kirk on the witness stand, Vince Bugliosi did, indeed, utilize the very important fact that JFK's head was "PUSHED FORWARD" at the instant of the head shot at Z313.

Because only a fool would argue that the FORWARD MOVEMENT of President Kennedy's head at the moment of impact somehow is indicative of that bullet entering JFK's skull FROM THE FRONT. That type of crazy argument is almost as ludicrous as Jim DiEugenio's laughable comments concerning the position of JFK's head that Jim made on Len Osanic's radio show on November 27, 2008 (45 minutes into the interview), which is when Jimmy actually claims that JFK's head remained in the exact same place between Z312 and Z313.

I guess Jim has just decided to totally ignore this Z-Film clip below, or Jim will just pretend that the obvious forward movement of JFK's head in this clip is merely the result of a "blur" or a "smear". (In case anyone needs the definition of such behavior, it's called Denying The Obvious.)....



And why on Earth DiEugenio seems to want to merge and meld the TWO separate things that Vince Bugliosi talks about on pages 485 and 486 of his book is beyond me.

That is, DiEugenio seems to be saying that Vincent's argument about JFK's head being "PUSHED FORWARD" (or, as Jim D. wants to put it, "TILTED FORWARD") and Bugliosi's separate argument about all of the blood and brain tissue being ejected to the FRONT of Kennedy's head just after the fatal shot are somehow tied together and inseparable.

When, in fact, one argument really has nothing to do with the other. Vince treats each of those things as separate (yet corroborative) arguments. He's not saying that the blood spray has anything to do (physically) with the forward head movement. They are independent of one another, with each separate argument being highly indicative that the head shot came from the rear. (Plus the added facts presented by Bugliosi in his book concerning all of the bullet fragments and skull fragments being found to the FRONT of the President in the car, which apparently are facts that CTers like Jim DiEugenio would rather not discuss at all.)

And it's THAT kind of from-the-rear head shot CORROBORATION that Vince Bugliosi was pleased to present to the jury in London in 1986 and to the readers of his book in 2007.

I'd like to also add the following video clip from Part 2 of the four-part 1967 CBS-TV "Warren Report" special, to help combat DiEugenio's "cavitation is non directional" argument. Quite obviously, not everybody agrees with James DiEugenio or Vincent DiMaio on this topic:




JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

Vince [Bugliosi] says on p. 485 that JFK's head was pushed forward and downward. (See fourth full paragraph.)

In the real world, this means it is tilted forward. For some reason you don't like that word, but forward and downward means tilted.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Yes, I can agree with you on the fact that "forward and downward means tilted". But "tilted" does NOT necessarily imply MOVEMENT of the head FORWARD. That was my point. And that is the HUGE point Bugliosi was making in his book when he talks about the positions of JFK's head in Z312 as compared to Z313.

If Vince were to have just used the word "tilted", he would not have conveyed the important point he needed to convey to his readers -- i.e., that JFK's head physically moved forward between frames 312 and 313, which is something I know you, James, do not believe (see, again, the 11/27/08 Black Op Radio broadcast for confirmation of Jim's denial of the forward head movement), but even so, the point Mr. Bugliosi wanted to convey was that Kennedy's head MOVED forward by about 2 inches at the moment of the head shot. And, IMO, the word you keep using ("tilted") does not convey the motion of the head that was absolutely essential for Vince to convey to his readers when he discussed this topic in his book "Reclaiming History".

BTW, Jim didn't use the word "tilted" when he discussed this topic in his radio interview with Len Osanic in November 2008. Instead, he used the words "leaning forward" to describe the positioning of JFK's head at Zapruder Frame #313, which are words that most certainly do not convey the sense of MOTION or MOVEMENT between Z312 and Z313 that Vincent Bugliosi was attempting to convey in his book (and which Vince did, of course, successfully convey to his readers via the language that he used in "Reclaiming History"). And that critical forward motion of JFK's head is something that Jim DiEugenio doesn't even bring up at all in that 2008 radio broadcast. Not once! In fact, as I said, Jim then goes on to DENY that there was any forward movement of JFK's head at all! The way Jim discussed the whole matter on that radio show was extremely misleading and completely misrepresents the things Bugliosi wrote in "Reclaiming History", with the FORWARD MOTION of Kennedy's head being completely ignored--as if Vince never even argued that point in his book. Shameful, Jim.

David Von Pein
March 9-11, 2017