MISC. JFK POSTS OF INTEREST
(PART 137)



--- COMING SOON ---



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JFK ASSASSINATION ARGUMENTS
(PART 1278)


RICH POPE SAID:

It's important to note that everyone who has [a] theory about JFK or writes a book about JFK can't always be right. And the government is happy when all these people are writing books, articles, blog posts etc... and they're wrong. Because it makes finding the truth impossible. When I came to this forum, I talked about different stuff. I had just written a book and things were fine.

Recently, I came home from work and my home office was destroyed. No money was taken, no TV's missing, it just looked like a tornado went through there. All the copies of the book I wrote were gone. My laptop was gone. And I realized that somewhere, somehow I made someone mad. I said something the government didn't like.

I had followed the advice of my late father and had two safes. One, a cheap safe that I kept in my office with some money in it, and a few non-important papers. The second, a rock of a safe bolted to the concrete floor of my basement. Whomever came, had no problem getting into the cheap safe. They left the money but took everything else. But they never found the second safe that had everything of importance in my life in it. I'm sure they will be back. I have things they want. But my family and my health is more important.

Of course the police have no leads. There were no fingerprints other than my own on the safe. But I have a dilemma. Keep posting things? Or try my best to just vanish. My advice to everyone here is simple. If you're not being harassed or followed by anyone because of what you say here or on other forums, be happy. You don't have the truth, because if you did, they would get to you as they did to me.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Why on Earth would you post what you just did above about the "second safe" in your basement? You just gave the evil "Government" crooks an invitation and a blueprint to come back and rob you again. Not a very bright idea, Rich. (And I assume you believe that the evil "Government" thieves who robbed you also spend a lot of time on forums like this one, and could easily read the post you just wrote above. Right? Otherwise, how do "they" even know you and your book exist?)

Also --- Do you really think that the "Government" burglars who robbed you were of the opinion that stealing all of your personal copies of your book would somehow eliminate all the OTHER copies of the book that undoubtedly exist (plus the galley proofs at the publishing house [if there is one], plus any "Kindle" e-book versions, etc.)? If not, what were they trying to do? Do you think they were just trying to send you a "message"?

Anyway....

Congratulations, Rich! You've apparently solved the 55-year-long JFK mystery!

So this means that Rich Pope is the only person in the universe who knows
"the truth". And that "truth" prompted the recent and unwelcome visit to his home by "Government" representatives.

That "Pope Solves The JFK Case" story is worthy of a BREAKING NEWS alert on CNN -- which I'll be anxiously awaiting.




DAVID ANDREWS SAID:

When you publish, Rich, you could post the police report on your author page on Amazon, to show you were The Man Who Knew Too Much - But They Couldn't Stop You. Sells copies.


RICH POPE SAID:

David [Andrews],

I'm not interested in "selling copies". The papers were useless and my laptop was one I only used for gaming (Alienware). Will they be back? Who knows and who cares? I've already removed what's important from my house (concerning JFK) and it's in a very safe place. And I could care less if people think this doesn't make sense. If you're too stupid to figure it out, let me explain it again...

The powers that be don't care about you if what you are writing isn't the truth. So if you're an author, blogger, podcast, professor, etc...and what you are teaching isn't true, the powers that be are not going to show you any interest. You are helping them through your unintended misinformation. And the more misinformation that's out there, the happier they are. You may have what you think are all the pieces of the puzzle in place, however if men wearing black suits aren't knocking on your door, then you've got it wrong.

Forums are fun for discussion, but do you really think anyone from one of the alphabet agencies monitors any of this? There's so much misinformation (unintended falsehoods) and disinformation (purposeful falsehoods) that this is never going to get solved, no matter how many years pass.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

It'll never get solved---except by you, right Rich? You're the only one who has hit on "the truth" re: the JFK assassination, correct? Otherwise, the "men wearing black suits" wouldn't have the slightest interest in you or your book. Right?

David Von Pein
April 30—May 1, 2018






DVP vs. DiEUGENIO
(PART 123)


[NOTE --- IN ADDITION TO JAMES DiEUGENIO
AND DVP, SOME OTHER PEOPLE TAKE PART
IN THIS DISCUSSION TOO.]



DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

As I stated two or three years ago, it's quite possible that the Hidell money order was part of a bulk transfer of postal money orders which was accompanied by a cash letter (deposit ticket), which could very well have had various stamps on it (i.e., the date of the transaction and the American Bankers Association [ABA] transit numbers).

It's silly, in my opinion, to believe that the Oswald/Hidell money order (Warren Commission Exhibit No. 788) is fraudulent, especially when we KNOW it was found just exactly where it should have been found—in Alexandria/Washington—on November 23, 1963.

And we also have information in Commission Document No. 75 coming from a First National Bank Vice President (Robert Wilmouth) verifying that First National DID handle the $21.45 Postal Money Order in question. (Unless conspiracy theorists want to argue that the $21.45 money order mentioned by Wilmouth in CD75 is a different $21.45 M.O. entirely.)


DAVID VON PEIN LATER SAID:

Perhaps banker Jason Ward can shed some light on the concept of "cash letters" and "bulk transfers" of U.S. Postal Money Orders.


JASON WARD SAID:

Sorry, we barely submit anything in paper form anymore and although I recall bulk transfers from earlier in my career, I don't have any details to share. I respond to you because you have a grip on rational thought--however, the whole topic should be at most two posts long: a non-banker asking for a banker's opinion followed by an answer in the next post.

If you don't believe ME, ok, simply print out the back of the money order and bring it to your bank and ask if this is a valid endorsement. The fact is with a large commercial depositor, no one at any stage of processing is checking the endorsement - it could be a scribble, it could be in Chinese, it could be missing entirely. The endorsement means almost nothing (in this case), likewise any "missing" endorsement or ABA number means nothing.

The Fed promulgated guidelines and has since time began never enforced them in routine daily transactions. Then and now processing occurs without signatures, with missing dates, and with all kinds of arguably invalid attributes. To imagine Klein's is in on the assassination is why CTers are seen as the lunatic fringe.

Imagining you can read a tiny snippet of federal regulations and become an expert on check processing without any bank experience is ridiculous.


JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

Jason:

Are you saying that CT's are the lunatic fringe?

1. Does this mean you believe the Single Bullet Fantasy?

Please click, as this always throws DVP into a tantrum....

KennedysAndKing.com/The Impossible One-Day Journey Of CE399

2. That Oswald got off three shots in six seconds, including 2 direct hits in the head and shoulder area?

Something that the legendary Carlos Hathcock, the greatest sniper of the Vietnam War said he could not do, no matter how many times he tried, and unlike the WC and CBS, he did not cheat.

3. That somehow, all those witnesses at Parkland and Bethesda somehow were all wrong about the hole in the back of JFK's head?

If so, why did the HSCA lie about their testimony?

4. That a bullet at the top of Kennedy's skull somehow damaged the cerebellum at the bottom of his skull?

5. That somehow Stringer forgot what kind of film he used for twenty years, and the process he used for autopsy photographs?

BTW, the idea that somehow Klein's had to be involved in the plot is so silly that I don't even think you really believe it. It's like saying REA [Railway Express Agency] planned part of the plot.

Finally, people who doubt the WR [Warren Report] are not in the "lunatic fringe". We are in a very big majority, anywhere from 61-75%, depending on whose poll you use.

And we would be in the low to mid nineties if not for the MSM. Which, when you use the term "lunatic fringe", you sound like you are a part of, or want to be part of.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Regarding this comment made by DiEugenio above:

"...the idea that somehow Klein's had to be involved in the plot is so silly that I don't even think you really believe it."

Given the fact that Klein's internal paperwork (Waldman #7) and a Klein's-produced microfilm for the order form for a rifle (Commission Exhibit #773) and the detailed testimony of Klein's Vice President William J. Waldman all play an integral and key role in the "Rifle Evidence" against Lee Harvey Oswald, I can't see any reasonable way for Klein's Sporting Goods Company of Chicago, Illinois, to NOT be "involved in the plot" that conspiracy theorists like James DiEugenio have invented for themselves.

Good gosh, the key and relevant rifle documents (CE773 and Waldman Exhibit No. 7) were, in fact, found in the Klein's files in Chicago, and were found by Klein's employees themselves early in the morning of 11/23/63.

But, incredibly, per conspiracy fantasists like Mr. DiEugenio, we're supposed to believe that there was really no such legitimate "Hidell" order form for Rifle C2766 found in the Klein's files at all! —— because Jim doesn't think Oswald/Hidell really ordered ANY rifle from Klein's at any time!

Talk about believing in something "silly". The "Oswald Never Ordered A Rifle At All" nonsense would certainly be it. And I don't see how any such ridiculous theory could possibly NOT include at least a few Klein's employees who must have been privy to the "plot". Maybe James D. can explain how that could have happened.


JIM HARGROVE SAID ALL THIS.


JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

Thanks Jim H, I knew DVP would walk into my trap, and I knew you would nail him on it.


JIM HARGROVE SAID:

A close examination of events shows that the FBI was just making up stories for a week following the assassination, before settling on the final legend.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

That's total nonsense, Jim. 

As I have mentioned in previous discussions, there are very sensible and logical (and non-sinister) explanations for the initial inaccurate reports concerning the details of the Hidell/Oswald rifle purchase -- particularly the confusion that arose from the "$12.78" figure and the "March 20" date.

But to an Internet conspiracy theorist, however, virtually everything done by Officialdom is looked at as being part of some secretive and underhanded plot. So silly.

I think more conspiracy believers should embrace Hanlon's Razor....

Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.


JIM HARGROVE SAID:

Well, [DVP] will probably just continue to wave Waldman 7 around and tell us how trustworthy the FBI was in this case. (Interesting, though, that the Bureau worked so hard to hide the fact it had confiscated Klein’s microfilm—preferring to let people believe it was safely locked away at Klein’s!) That’s how they had the opportunity to alter the documents.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Yeah, that must be why the FBI wrote up Commission Document No. 75, which plainly states that William J. Waldman relinquished control of the microfilm on 11/23/63 to the FBI, with Waldman himself saying that very thing in his Warren Commission testimony.

Waldman also put his initials on the cardboard box containing the microfilm (FBI Exhibit D-77 / Waldman Exhibit No. 6). And the date "11-23-63" appears twice on the cardboard box as well.

CD75 also plainly says that Waldman made available the microfilm "from a safe in his control", which perfectly aligns with the earlier FBI FD-302 report we find in CD7.

And when examining both reports (CD7 vs. CD75), we see that the EXACT same detailed information is provided in both reports regarding the things that were found on the Klein's "Order Blank" (which would become Waldman No. 7) -- e.g., the transaction number, the VC number, the C2766 serial number, the March 20th date, etc.

All info is identical in both FBI reports, one of which (CD7) was written prior to the FBI taking the microfilm from Waldman/Klein's; with the second report (CD75) being prepared after the FBI took control of the microfilm from Klein's.

CTers like John Armstrong evidently think that BOTH of those FBI reports are false and full of lies regarding the things the FBI agents saw on the Order Blank provided by Klein's. But in reality, the truth is:

William Waldman kept possession of the microfilm in his safe for just a very short period of time on 11/23/63 (certainly no more than a few hours) before he turned it over to the FBI that very same day. CD7 precedes CD75 as far as the chronological order of the reports.

And if you're a person who isn't prone to thinking the FBI faked everything imaginable concerning the JFK case, then CD7 -- all by itself -- provides the written proof that Klein's Sporting Goods most definitely had in its possession on November 23, 1963, an internal "Order Blank" for a 6.5-mm. Italian rifle (Serial # C2766) that was shipped by Klein's to "A. Hidell" in Dallas on 3/20/63.

That should be enough, right there, for all reasonable people to stamp this mystery "Solved".


JASON WARD SAID:

This in my count is version #3 of how they came to determine the rifle came from Klein's.

[...]

The appearance of manufactured evidence and chaotic, ludicrous explanations like this one from Pinkston is all over the place.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

But keep in mind, Jason, that the Nat Pinkston quote previously supplied is a quote from July of 2007. That makes it 44 years after the events took place, and Pinkston is trying to recall every small detail. He likely got a few details wrong.

But, essentially, Pinkston's 2007 account is fairly accurate with respect to how the FBI first was made aware of Klein's in Chicago (with Dallas FBI agents scouring local gun shops to try and find a store that might have sold the Italian-made rifle).

Pinkston, however, left out one of the steps that led the FBI to Klein's---Crescent Firearms in New York. But, again, it's 44 years after the fact (per that document posted previously by David Josephs), so I'd cut Pinkston a tiny bit of slack on some of the details. Wouldn't you?



Someone might ask --- But, Dave, how could Pinkston possibly get things so mixed up--even 44 years after the fact? And why didn't he mention Crescent Firearms, etc.?

Well, you just never know how a person's memory of an event is going to be recalled so many years later. A good example of this would be when Buell Wesley Frazier decided (for some reason) to start adding things to his story in about 2002. Frazier, at that time in '02, started saying in interviews [like this one] that he had actually seen Lee Oswald walking down Houston Street shortly after the assassination, which is a detail that completely contradicts what Frazier said in his 11/22/63 affidavit. And I don't think for a minute that Buell Frazier is a deliberate liar at all. But, for some odd reason, that extra info about seeing Oswald out on the street at about 12:35 to 12:40 on November 22nd has now surfaced every time Buell is interviewed. ~shrug~


RON BULMAN SAID:

There is absolutely no proof REA ever shipped a gun to him [Oswald] or Hidell.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

You must be joking. The Seaport Traders & REA paper trails are extensive, and provide conclusive proof (via their paperwork) that Revolver V510210 was shipped to "Hidell" in March '63.

Is all this paperwork supposedly phony too?

Plus, Oswald was caught with the Tippit murder weapon ON HIM on 11/22/63. So why anyone even CARES about where or when Oswald initially gained possession of the revolver eight months earlier is something I fail to completely understand. I think the priorities of CTers regarding the topic of Oswald's pistol are misguided (to say the least).


JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID:

I am still trying to get a reply about what is the proof, or evidence, that LHO picked up the handgun from REA.

I also think he [Jason Ward] is saying that LHO did get the rifle in question, and the FBI knew about it. I guess he knows none of the problems with that transaction.

BTW, since Ward is such a great pontificator to us all about the rules of evidence etc, (maybe he is lawyer also?) when is he going to explain why it's the wrong rifle?

Or maybe he will just defer us to Von Pein.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

DiEugenio, of course, knows full well what the logical and reasonable answer is to his perpetual "Wrong Rifle" BS. It's been explained to him dozens of times. But he'll continue to pretend that it's an explanation that makes no sense at all---even though it makes perfect sense, especially when we consider what length of rifle Klein's started selling to its mail-order customers in April of 1963, very shortly after Oswald purchased his gun from Klein's.

David Von Pein
April 24-27, 2018





ALSO SEE:


JFK ASSASSINATION ARGUMENTS
(PART 1277)


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Questions Never Answered By Conspiracy Theorists .... Click Here.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

That's simply untrue. I can EASILY answer any evidential question in this case with credible answers... David will run from these answers, and ABSOLUTELY REFUSE to show that they aren't reasonable and credible.

Believers [in Lee Oswald's lone guilt], on the other hand, simply cannot answer questions on the evidence.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

This is what happens, folks, when a desperate CTer tries to explain away all the evidence that points to Oswald (which, of course, is ALL the evidence). The CTer ends up looking very silly when attempting to square away everything into a nice little "Conspiracy" package (with Oswald being featured as the make-believe "Patsy" in the conspiracy theorist's imaginary plot).

My favorite gut-buster delivered by desperate Mr. Holmes in this 3/5/2017 forum post is this little gem below (in which Holmes was answering my question "Where did those two bullets go [that entered JFK's body but never exited]?"....

"My guess would be into Dr. Humes' pocket." -- B. Holmes

Via the above humorous response, Holmes is pretending that he's got enough evidence to make Dr. James J. Humes one of the prime "plotters" in the imaginary conspiracy and cover-up. Needless to say, Holmes has ZERO evidence to make such an outrageous accusation against Dr. Humes.

But "ZERO evidence" never stopped a determined JFK conspiracy theorist. Just ask Ben Holmes.


BORIS SAID:

David Von Pein,

One would think that if you were capable of being ashamed, you would be WHOLLY EMBARRASSED--or possibly wholly stupid--by daring to start a thread called "Questions Never Answered By Conspiracy Theorists" when you are the number one violator of answering to nothing.

Apart from the fact that you are the only person here with vested MONETARY GAIN to support the lone assassin theory, you just presented a series of questions that any CTer would be scared to answer. Which were promptly answered. Then you doubled down by cherry picking only one of those answers, briefly mocking it, and ignoring everything else.

You're a total fraud, David Von Pein. And here's why...

In the JFK Forum on Amazon, we discussed witnesses whose stories kept changing, and I asked you to produce ONE SINGLE EXAMPLE of a witness whose story changed in a way which absolved Oswald. Your response to me was that you could not think of one offhand, but that you BET THE FARM there was one, and that you would find it. Do you remember that? I bet you do, buddy boy. You remember saying that perfectly well.

Remember? It occurred just before you DISAPPEARED.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

And you are totally nuts, "Boris", if you really think that ANY of these eight questions have truly been answered in a reasonable and believable fashion by any conspiracy theorist. Not one of my 8 inquiries has been satisfactorily answered by anybody in the Conspiracy Fantasy Camp. (And certainly not by "Boris".)


BORIS SAID:

Your "kook" and "nuts" and "whackjob" charges are totally boring, you waste. I thought you were a writer. Come up with some new shit.

Do I really think your questions were answered? Yes, in triplicate. By definition, they were answered. What you mean is, they were not answered to your liking. Which is fine. But to say they weren't is a lie. Which isn't fine. The title of this thread is a lie. This thread is manifest of what a dishonest person you are. You made a mistake by starting this thread. You should hope it dies and slowly slinks away into obscurity. Just like you asshole lone nutters.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

And Question #7 particularly stands out as a question I've asked CTers dozens of times in the last 15 years, and I've yet to hear any kind of a sensible answer. And the reason that no conspiracy theorist can reasonably answer Question #7 is because: There is no reasonable and sensible answer to that inquiry. Here's #7 again....

7.) If a pre-arranged "solo patsy" plot really existed prior to 11/22/63 (as per the plot proposed by kooks like Jim Garrison and Oliver Stone and many other conspiracy theorists), then why on Earth did the conspirators try to kill JFK by firing multiple guns from different angles in Dallas' Dealey Plaza? Were those plotters just playing it safe? Or were they merely retarded idiots who wanted the plot to be uncovered within minutes of shooting the President from so many different angles?

Good luck answering that one in a reasonable and believable fashion, "Boris".


BORIS SAID:

Simple. Because they didn't give a fuck what the public saw, they were going to sell the story anyway. And they did, at least to idiots like yourself. Not hard to do in 1963, in the days before Internet and back when trust in government was high. Operation Mockingbird helped as well. Or will you deny the existence of the Mighty Wurlitzer? Your refusing to address it will signal to me I'm right.

Yes. The frontal shooters were insurance, in case the target still was not down before exiting the triangular kill zone.

No. They didn't have to be retarded idiots. Only the people they sold their story to had to be.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

You're really rotten at this "Reasonable & Believable" thing, "Boris". Because any plot that requires a "Lone Patsy Named Oswald" would not have included ANY FRONTAL SHOOTERS. And all reasonable people know why this is so. But since you're a loon from the Anybody-But-Oswald Club, you have to (somehow) come up with some sorry-ass excuse for why those two wholly incompatible things—
"A Patsy In The TSBD" and "Frontal Gunshots"—can (somehow) fit together in this JFK case.

And your answer—"Because they didn't give a fuck what the public saw, they were going to sell the story anyway"—reeks of sorry-ass desperation for sure.*

* And I'm guessing that your above laughable response is the first time you've ever written down those sorry-ass words in your whole life. And it's understandable why you wouldn't want to type out those words previously—
because who wants to deliberately embarrass themselves with such goofy and obviously-made-up dreck from the bottom of the conspiracy barrel? I sure wouldn't. You should have kept your yap shut this time too, because your desperate/lame-ass response is now available for everyone to read from this day forward.

Now take a crack at Question #4, "Boris". I'm sure your answer to that inquiry will even exceed your last answer in the "lame-ass" department. (BTW, I forget your real name from our Amazon discussions, which have now been wiped out from existence forever by Amazon.com due to the discontinuation of their "Discussion Boards". But I'm pretty sure I have never conversed with anyone named "Boris" before.)

David Von Pein
March 5, 2017—April 8, 2018