JFK ASSASSINATION ARGUMENTS
(PART 1031)


DUNCAN MacRAE SAID:

"Prayer Man" Is A Woman....

PM is a woman wearing a long buttoned coat.

[...]

I officially rename Prayer Man as Button Lady....










DUNCAN MacRAE LATER SAID:

While it is entirely possible that I am wrong in agreeing with Patrick Jackson about Scarf Lady being the mystery person, I am 100% confident that the mystery Button Lady figure formerly known as Prayer Man is in fact a woman, and she is probably holding a purse in front of her in a classic female pose....




ROBERT PRUDHOMME SAID:

Duncan can see all kinds of things in that photo that no one else can see.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Gee, that sure sounds familiar. Where have I heard stuff like that before?

The pot/kettle irony that emanates from CTers nearly every day is unparalleled.

Badge Man.
Prayer Man.
Black Dog Man.
Tan Jacket Man.
Etc., etc...

And just two days ago, conspiracy theorist and nine-year Education Forum veteran Kathleen Collins took the time to send me a private e-mail in order to provide me with this bombshell proof of a gunman she sees in the Nix Film. The assassin in the film apparently decided to fire a rifle at the President while standing right out in the open where everybody could easily see (and film) him. Those Presidential assassins sure were brilliant planners, weren't they?....

=======================================

Subject: Nix film
Date: 9/16/2015 11:58:24 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time
From: Kathleen (Kathy) Collins
To: David Von Pein

--------------------------

Dear David,

Here is a link to the Nix film that shows a man, leaning on a car, shooting. Whoever put the clip up is pointing to 2 other men. But clearly, the man at the car is shooting....

http://youtube.com/watch?v=gvz6sxhb3PA

Kathy Collins


=======================================


ROBERT PRUDHOMME SAID:

So, you agree that Dunc's "analysis" of PM is bogus?


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

It's impossible for me to tell. It's an analysis of pure mush and trying to make it solid. Can't be done with the awful, worthless image we have to deal with there. (IMHO.)

One thing is a certainty, however --- "Prayer (Wo)Man" is definitely NOT Lee Harvey Oswald. Even Oswald himself confirmed that fact....


REPORTER -- "Did you shoot the President?"

LEE HARVEY OSWALD -- "I work in that building."

REPORTER -- "Were you in the building at the time?"

LEE HARVEY OSWALD -- "Naturally, if I work in that building, yes, sir."



video


ROBERT PRUDHOMME SAID:

I will accept that as a total putdown of MacRae's "research analysis" or whatever he calls it.

Believe it or not, I, too, would like to see a better refining of this still of ["Prayer Man"] before I am completely convinced of anything about it.

P.S.,

Still pretty shaky interpretation of him being in that building. If I was to step out on the steps, but never left the alcove at the top of the steps, I might, if quickly answering a reporter's question, still have considered myself "in" that building.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Bob,

I've discussed that "Inside or Outside?" subject with other people in the past, such as this discussion with J. Raymond Carroll in July of 2014....


RAYMOND CARROLL SAID:

Slight problem there, David: No motive, no means, and he was watching from the front steps. But you are correct that he acted alone!


DVP SAID:

J. Raymond Carroll is one of the very few conspiracy theorists on the planet who thinks Lee Oswald was totally innocent of everything regarding JFK's death---that is: Lee didn't even have any knowledge at all of the plot to kill the President. Lee was as innocent as Mother Teresa, per J. Raymond. That's how far afield from reality Mr. Carroll has strayed.

And I see that Raymond has been gullible enough to fall for the worn-out "Oswald Was Doorway Man" schtick too. Oh, my. Ray is in trouble.

I wonder if Ray can explain to us why Oswald HIMSELF lied about his location at the time of the assassination? Or does Raymond think that being on the front steps of the Book Depository is the same thing as being "inside" the building?


RAYMOND CARROLL SAID:

Lee Oswald was "out with Bill Shelley in front," just as he told Fritz. The front steps are actually "in the building," as you can see for yourself if you go there.

The proof is in the Darnell film, discovered by Sean Murphy, and you can see it for yourself in this thread on the Education Forum.


DVP SAID:

Nobody who was standing on the TSBD steps would ever say they were "in the building". That's nuts. The steps are OUTSIDE the front door, for Pete sake [see photo below]. And it goes to show how desperate CTers like Raymond Carroll truly are to exonerate a double-murderer.




RAYMOND CARROLL SAID:

He never said he was "inside," he said he was "in the building." Since the steps he was standing on are within the building's structure, he was quite correct in stating he was "out with Bill Shelley in front" yet still "in the building."

Actually, we cannot hear the question in the video, and the question may have been "were you in the building TODAY?"

Anyway, we don't have to parse what he said. The Darnell film PROVES he was on the front steps.


DVP SAID:

The Darnell Film proves no such thing. Your "Prayer Man" could be almost anybody. But you now like the idea that "PM" was Oswald---so, it's Oswald.

And we most certainly CAN hear the reporter's question to Oswald. The reporter clearly says: "Were you in the building at the time?"

Oswald's answer: "Naturally, if I work in that building, yes sir."

And what do you think Oswald thought the reporter meant by "AT THE TIME"? Considering the previous question had been: "Did you shoot the President?", I don't think there's much doubt.

[...]

Again, only a person hell-bent on finding Oswald innocent for some odd reason could possibly think these steps are located "in the building"....



-- DVP; July 2014


DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:

And if Oswald had really been standing on the steps in front of the Book Depository Building at 12:30 PM, why did he tell Captain Fritz that he was on the first floor eating lunch at just about that same time?....

"I asked him what part of the building he was in at the time the President was shot, and he said that he was having his lunch about that time on the first floor." -- Captain J.W. Fritz; Warren Report; Page 600

Also....

As I said HERE in August 2013, it's interesting to note "Stetson Man" (on the left) as he seems to look up toward the upper floors of the TSBD just after the shots were fired....




In addition, I noticed something else in the film frame below today....

It looks to me as if the man on the far right might be looking UP toward the upper TSBD floors too. It looks like his head is tilted upward here. So this image would certainly tend to indicate that at least two other people in Dealey Plaza had their attention drawn to the upper floors of the Book Depository Building within seconds of the last shot being fired at President Kennedy....




TONY FRATINI SAID:

Both men were probably wondering what Jarman, Norman and Williams on the 5th floor were doing with [their] heads sticking out the window?


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

But what would have caused those two men to look up there in the first place to even notice Jarman, Norman, and Williams?

Those three fifth-floor parade watchers didn't shout down to the street, "Hey, Mr. Stetson Man, look up here!!"


TONY FRATINI SAID:

Well, the shots did pass "over their heads" -- yet not everyone in DP [Dealey Plaza] uniformly looked up at the upper floors of the TSBD. Post shots, most ran to the railroad tracks. Officer Baker saw pigeons fly up into the air. There could be a multitude of reasons why people would look up.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Yeah, with one really good reason being....




TONY FRATINI SAID:

Have you worked out how LHO got CE142 to the SE corner yet?


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Oswald was all alone on the TSBD's sixth floor for several minutes on 11/22/63. So why would it have been an impossible feat for the man who was ALL ALONE up there to have moved a paper bag (and a rifle) to a different part of the sixth floor during the period of time when he was ALL ALONE up on that sixth floor? I see no problem with this at all.

Why do you see a problem with it, Tony?

I await your logical pro-CT response (if such a response is possible).


DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:

FWIW.....

I really have no idea if the "Prayer" person is a male or a female, but I took note of this statement in Commission Document No. 706 (also found in CE1381) by Mrs. Pauline Sanders, a 55-year-old white female, who was standing on the TOP STEP of the Book Depository Building at the time of the President's assassination.

Sanders, however, said she was standing on the EAST side of the top step, so that wouldn't exactly fit the bill for "Prayer Person's" position. But it's pretty close.

In her March 19, 1964, FBI statement, Mrs. Sanders said that another woman, Sarah Stanton (age 41), was "standing next to me" on the steps of the Depository. Here is Stanton's 3/18/64 FBI statement.

So that means there were definitely two different women (aged 55 and 41) standing on the steps of the TSBD during the time of the assassination (and very likely on the top step, and that looks like the same step where "Prayer Person" is located).

And here is an FBI report regarding an interview with Pauline Sanders on 11/24/63 (CE1434).


DAVID VON PEIN LATER SAID:

To illustrate the fact that virtually anything can get published if it deals with a "JFK conspiracy" (no matter how silly and speculative and unprovable and blurry it might be), we now have "Prayer Man" in book form. Incredible. ....




David Von Pein
September 18, 2015
September 20-21, 2015
September 21, 2015
November 2, 2015 (EST)