LEN OSANIC SAID:
Here is a forwarded question from Jeff Carter:
"[I am] watching same-day TV coverage of the assassination and I am curious when Oswald was first identified by name in the media. The earliest I have found is interesting. .... [The] footage [linked here] originates from ABC's network studio in New York, where news anchor Don Goddard is on camera with network VP and former Eisenhower press man James Hagerty.
Over the course of several segments, Hagerty had been making a case that this has the appearance of a well-planned conspiracy. He is finishing up a discussion of the difficulties of Secret Service protection in large-city motorcades when Goddard says: "Well, this adds one to the case for conspiracy then. And the Dallas Police are apparently trying to add another--they have arrested a 24-year-old man, Lee Oswald, in connection with a slaying of a Dallas policeman and presumably also the slaying of a secret service man in another part of Dallas which happened shortly before the President..."
Hagerty inhales and cuts Goddard off to praise quick reaction by the Secret Service in speeding away from Dealey Plaza. (Based on eyewitness report from ABC reporter Bob Clark, who also interestingly said that the motorcade came to a complete halt, which Hagerty does not mention). (The story of a dead Secret Service man has been attached to the news from Oak Cliff up to this time, but soon is dropped.)
This sequence occurs soon after Zapruder's appearance on the local affiliate (WFAA-TV), which began approx. 2:10 PM CST -- so the Oswald ID as delivered by Goddard happens somewhere between 2:20—2:25 PM CST (certainly before 2:30). Not only that, Goddard appears to read this information from a piece of paper which has been sitting before him since they returned to air immediately following Zapruder.
Interestingly, the local affiliate WFAA follows up about a half hour later with information attributed to DPD captain Pat Gannaway that the "suspect" worked at the TSBD and lived in Russia [again see the link above]. Oswald's name and age are not mentioned.
Would this mean that Oswald's name and age was available to ABC's network office in NYC before it was announced to reporters in Dallas?"
DAVID ANDREWS SAID:
Thanks for this footage, Len.
LEN OSANIC SAID:
Don't thank me, thank DVP, who collected and posted all this stuff to YouTube. Annoying as he can be, he has done good service here.
LEN OSANIC ALSO SAID:
Jeff [Carter], who originally posited the question, has followed up:
"JFK Countercoup published an account of early AP and UPI wire service reports on March 12, 2012. AP sent out wire report mentioning Oswald by name and age at 2:35 PM CST. That is probably what is on the ABC desk in NYC. So the time of the broadcast can be pushed to around 2:40-2:45 CST.
Affiliate WFAA-TV adds the TSBD and Russia angle about a half hour later - attributed to DPD captain Gannaway.
Note: DPD are already at the Paines, and were greeted with "We've been expecting you", although it is clear that there was definitely no way of hearing LHO ID from arrest from the media."
WILLIAM KELLY SAID (QUOTING FROM AN E-MAIL WRITTEN BY GARY MACK, CURATOR OF THE SIXTH FLOOR MUSEUM AT DEALEY PLAZA):
"From the Museum's Zapruder time line
(http://jfk.org/Zapruder-Film-Chronology):
2:20 p.m.
WFAA assistant news director and chief photographer Bert Shipp called Kodak, asking them to process the 8mm color film, since the station had only 16mm black-and-white film equipment.
2:31 p.m.
Zapruder appeared live on ABC and WFAA with WFAA's program director, Jay Watson, while Schwartz stood nearby holding the camera with the film.
2:40 p.m.
Zapruder, Schwartz, and Sorrels, riding in a Dallas police car, arrived at the Kodak lab near Dallas Love Field about the time Air Force One took off for Washington with Kennedy's body.
The Zapruder appearance time is exact, according to tapes and other documentation at The Sixth Floor Museum. The very first media mention of Oswald by name came at 3:46 Dallas time. The ABC clip posted (from Dave Von Pein's site!) aired much later than the Zapruder interview.
Gary"
LEN OSANIC SAID:
A follow-up from Jeff Carter:
"I don't necessarily want to question the knowledge of folks who have spent a lot more time with this footage, but what is available and listed as WFAA-TV (posted on YouTube) has the appearance of being contiguous, even as it fades after the Zapruder interview as the anchor says they are returning to NY.
The reasons for saying this are that a) Jim Hagerty does not appear again after this segment; b) the following sequence after returning to the Dallas station features the host [making] direct reference to Hagerty's comments about the bubble-top; c) they are still referring to a rifle found on the "fifth floor".
None of this is consistent with this segment being done "much later", and a "much later" segment being pasted in is not consistent with how this footage plays out (i.e. it doesn't seem to happen anywhere else).
It may be simply an academic point, but I believe this is strong evidence that Lee Oswald's name first crossed the airwaves here on ABC-TV at around 2:40 PM CST. If so, there is an irony in that Oswald's name is contained in a sentence which also contains the word "conspiracy". ABC was the least watched network that day, but they scored some scoops."
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
FYI---
I did make some edits during my WFAA-TV video series. And also keep in mind that all of that WFAA footage comes from a 1983 WFAA retrospective program entitled "The Kennedy Tapes", hosted by Tracy Rowlett.
And that '83 program, while containing a lot of "long form" segments of uncut WFAA footage from November 1963, also has been heavily edited in many areas, with Rowlett filling in gaps along the way with brief narration before moving on to another section of "long form" coverage. As I recall, however, the majority of the extensive editing comes later in the "Kennedy Tapes" program, during the November 23-25 segments.
The "fade out" that was mentioned above (right after Mr. Zapruder's complete 2:31 PM CST interview) is one that I definitely remember putting in myself. That's not an '83 edit done for "The Kennedy Tapes" broadcast. But I cannot recall how much time elapses between the time of the Zapruder fade-out and the place where I pick up the live footage once again.
I have the raw DVD-R discs from which I extracted the video files for online use, and if I should get time in the future, I would be happy to look and see what material I edited out, and how much elapsed time was edited. But offhand I can't remember. It's been about 5 years since I created that WFAA series.
ONE DAY LATER, DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Correction:
I was incorrect when I said that the edit right after Zapruder's WFAA interview was wholly my own edit. I have checked my raw DVD source for that material, and the only thing I edited out at that point was some of Tracy Rowlett's narration and an intro jingle that was used in 1983 by WFAA for the "Kennedy Tapes" broadcast.
When I wrote my post yesterday on this matter, I had thought there was some footage missing after Zapruder's interview, but there definitely isn't, because after the break that was put into the '83 show, it cuts back to Jay Watson and Abe Zapruder for just a split second before the cut is made to ABC in New York and Jim Hagerty. So I can tell that the '83 show picked up the WFAA coverage again without any edits after the Zapruder interview.
In fact, the split-second of footage which shows Watson and Zapruder AFTER the edit is even included in my YouTube version (fast forward to 1:44:19 in this video, which is also embedded below).
Sorry for my earlier error, and I hope I didn't confuse or mislead anyone on this matter to any great degree.
LEN OSANIC SAID:
The ABC network desk in New York ID's Oswald by (likely) 2:30 CST. It can be timed because it immediately follows Abraham Zapruder's appearance on the local affiliate.
WILLIAM KELLY SAID (POSSIBLY QUOTING FROM ANOTHER E-MAIL RECEIVED FROM GARY MACK):
"Lee H. Oswald" was first named at 3:46pm CST. The timing comes from the original WFAA and WBAP radio tapes, which means their source was either a local reporter or UPI.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Bill,
Len is correct (almost) regarding this matter. Because that time of 3:46 CST is positively not accurate (unless the 2:31 PM CST timestamp for the Zapruder interview as shown in the "Zapruder Film Time Line" is incorrect).
I just checked my WFAA-TV footage and found that ABC News in New York is saying the name "Lee Oswald" at approximately 2:40 PM CST. BTW, the ABC anchorman doesn't say "Lee H. Oswald" at that point in time. He just says "Lee Oswald", without including the middle initial.
The 2:40 PM timestamp can be obtained by the timing of the Zapruder interview (as Len Osanic mentioned). And I can only assume that the "2:31 PM" timing for Zapruder's WFAA interview is referring to when that interview STARTED, not when it ended. Not that that would be a huge difference in real time either way, because the whole uncut interview with Zapruder lasted just a shade less than five minutes.
So if the Zapruder interview began at 2:31 PM CST (as it says on the Sixth Floor Museum website), it's easy to time other events that occur just after that interview. Following the Zapruder interview, four minutes elapse before ABC in New York announces that Lee Oswald had been arrested. And there are definitely no breaks or edits in that WFAA coverage after Zapruder's interview up until the time when Oswald's name is mentioned over ABC-TV in New York.
Therefore, we have a 2:31 PM starting point, plus five minutes for the entire Zapruder interview, plus four minutes after the interview....which would equal Oswald's name first being uttered on ABC-TV at about 2:40 PM CST (3:40 PM EST).
Bill, I wonder if someone has confused Central time with Eastern time in that 3:46 PM timestamp you and Gary Mack posted earlier. Because it was, indeed, very close to 3:46 EASTERN time when we hear ABC say the name "Oswald" on the air. That would, of course, be a common and understandable "time zone" error for someone to have made. The same type of one-hour mistake in time occurred in Wayne Hawks' transcript for the Perry/Clark Parkland press conference.
But I really can't see where some of the conspiracy theorists can go with this information concerning the first time Oswald's name was spoken on live TV on November 22. By 2:40 PM CST, Oswald had been in custody for about 50 minutes, and he had been inside City Hall for approximately 40 minutes. So there was certainly ample time there for a crack reporter or two, who would have undoubtedly been hungry for information about this guy the cops just brought into the police station in handcuffs, to dig out the name "Oswald" from somebody at Dallas City Hall.
And, quite obviously (via the WFAA footage that does exist), that is exactly what DID happen (even though there was the initial confusion as to what Oswald's real name was--Oswald or Hidell). Somebody was able to find out from someone at the Dallas Police Department, prior to 2:40 PM CST, that the man who had just been arrested in the Texas Theater was named Lee Oswald. Simple as that.
E-Mail From: Gary Mack
To: David Von Pein
Date: 2/14/2013 1:58:33 PM EST
Hi Dave,
The Kennedy Tapes, as broadcast in 1983, has a few segments out of sequence since the original WFAA tapes were rarely marked with exact times. John Sparks produced that series and we’ve been friends and, for awhile at KXAS years later, coworkers since then. Both John and Tracy Rowlett are still active in local broadcasting.
WFAA donated all its tapes and films to The Sixth Floor Museum in 1998; five years later when we made new digital masters of the original tapes, I confirmed that the station did not record continuously that weekend or even the first day.
Finally, The Sixth Floor Museum’s collections include a copy of the ABC News log of the network’s weekend coverage, and their documentation showed the very first mention of Oswald by name came at 3:48pm Dallas time. It was preceded at 3:43 by a live WFAA report from Ed Hogan and followed at 3:54 by an audio report from Bernard Kaplan in Paris.
Gary Mack
E-Mail From: Gary Mack
To: David Von Pein
Date: 2/14/2013 7:48:12 PM EST
Some of my previous information was incorrect. From The Sixth Floor Museum's index of the original WBAP tapes is this description (written by a former WBAP staffer who digitized them). I have no evidence to contradict his summary:
16. 2:43 pm WBAP's David Daniel interrupts for word from Dallas Police of the arrest of "a 24-year-old man, Lee H. Oswald" in connection with the shooting of Dallas Police Officer J.D. Tippit. He's being questioned to see if he has any connection with JFK assassination. "Oswald was pulled screaming and yelling" from the Texas Theater in the Oak Cliff section of Dallas. After a pistol is taken from him during a scuffle, he's quoted as saying, "It's all over now."
I must have overlooked an EST reference, for which I apologize.
Gary Mack
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The WBAP-Radio news report by David Daniel at 2:43 PM CST on 11/22/63, mentioned by Gary Mack in his e-mail above, can be heard here.
E-Mail From: David Von Pein
To: Gary Mack
Date: 2/14/2013 8:24:30 PM EST
Thanks, Gary. I've been expecting to hear from you on this.
So, via the WBAP log, it appears that my 2:40 PM CST timestamp for the ABC-TV "Oswald" announcement (which another person, Jeff Carter, also mentioned in the forum thread) is probably spot-on accurate.
David V.P.
E-Mail From: Gary Mack
To: David Von Pein
Date: 2/14/2013 9:15:58 PM EST
Must be. But I'm really baffled by some of this. I checked the ABC log this afternoon and I could swear the log said 4:46 was the time, which means 3:46 in Dallas. Just before I sent you and Bill [Kelly] the note tonight, I found that NBC gave Oswald's name at 3:23 Dallas time, but then I found where I sent someone else the WBAP quote months ago. So if I have the time tomorrow, I'll check the ABC log again. Weird.
Gary
E-Mail From: David Von Pein
To: Gary Mack
Date: 2/14/2013 9:51:28 PM EST
But isn't it possible that there was an earlier ABC report mentioning Oswald at 2:40 PM CST, along with the 3:46 PM CST report you have mentioned? Maybe somebody merely overlooked the 2:40 report by mistake.
DVP
[2021 DVP INTERJECTION --- Eight years after my above conversation with Gary Mack, it occurred to me that Gary was very likely referring to the ABC Radio log, instead of referring to an ABC Television log. I say this because this ABC Radio Network Log for the assassination weekend does, indeed, show that the name "Lee H. Oswald" was mentioned on the ABC Radio Network at precisely 4:46:05 PM EST (3:46 PM CST) on 11/22/63, just as Gary Mack suggested. But that same ABC News Log also indicates that Oswald's name had been mentioned on the air (on radio) more than an hour earlier--at 3:37 PM EST (2:37 PM CST), which would match almost perfectly with when the ABC-TV network first uttered Oswald's name as well.]
DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:
After digging into this matter a little further, I have been able to positively confirm that Lee Oswald's name is first mentioned on the ABC Television Network (and on WFAA-TV in Dallas) at approximately 2:40 PM Dallas time (Central Standard Time).
The way I was able to confirm it is by comparing the WFAA-TV local Dallas coverage with the raw feed from the ABC-TV network footage that I also have in my collection.
They are identical when comparing the timeframe in question, starting with Abraham Zapruder's WFAA interview and continuing for several minutes after that interview concludes. And the timing on the ABC Network raw feed works out to just exactly what I said earlier -- ABC said the name "Lee Oswald" at just about 2:40 PM CST, which was precisely four minutes after Jay Watson of WFAA finished his interview with Abraham Zapruder. For confirmation of this, go to 1:44:35 thru 1:48:35 in this ABC-TV video [also embedded below].
As I mentioned earlier, the 2:40 PM CST timestamp hinges on the Zapruder interview beginning at the time when the Sixth Floor Museum chronology says it began--2:31 PM CST. But I think I can pretty much confirm that timestamp as well, via the two hours of uncut ABC-TV coverage shown above, which begins at approximately 12:51 PM CST.
DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:
FYI....
As for the other two U.S. television networks—CBS and NBC—the first time that the CBS Television Network mentioned Oswald's name on the air came at 2:59 PM Dallas Time (3:59 PM EST) on November 22nd, when anchorman Walter Cronkite said that the man the Dallas police had in custody after a fight in the Texas Theater was named "Leo H. Oswald" [go to 2:29:15 in this CBS video, also viewable below].
Interestingly, Walter Cronkite's error regarding Lee Harvey Oswald's name wouldn't be the last time that Walter mangled Oswald's name on the air that weekend in 1963. In two other separate reports aired on the weekend of the assassination, Cronkite misspoke again when saying LHO's name, telling the TV audience in one of those reports that the alleged assassin's name was "Lee Henry Oswald"; while in another report, Mr. Cronkite said the suspect's name was "Lee Harvey Osburn".
As far as the NBC-TV assassination coverage is concerned, the first time we hear the name Lee Oswald occurs at roughly 3:20 PM Central Time on 11/22/63 [at the 2:30:50 mark in this video, also seen below], when newsman Charles Murphy of NBC's Dallas/Fort Worth affiliate WBAP-TV says this on the network:
"Homicide detective Leavelle told WBAP newsman James Kerr in Dallas a few minutes ago they have little doubt that 24-year-old Lee Oswald of Dallas is the man who shot and killed Dallas police officer J.D. Tippit shortly after President Kennedy was shot to death this afternoon. Oswald was pulled screaming and shouting from the Texas Theater by officers who had gone there on a tip that Oswald was there. He brandished a pistol which officers took away from him after a struggle. Oswald was quoted as saying, "It's all over now." .... The coincidence in the case is that Oswald worked as a stockman at the Texas Book Depository, the building from which the sniper shot President Kennedy. Dallas police have declined to say whether they think Oswald is connected with the assassination."
David Von Pein
February 14-15, 2013
July 18-19, 2016
