Part 1373 of my "JFK Assassination Arguments" series includes a variety of my posts and comments covering the period of February 1—29, 2024. To read the entire forum discussion from which my own comments have been extracted, click on the "Full Discussion" logo at the bottom of each individual segment.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Excerpt from Vincent Bugliosi's book "Reclaiming History":
David Von Pein
February 1, 2024
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AARON SHARPE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Oh my goodness! Education Forum member Aaron Sharpe thinks a theory which has JFK's body being stolen off of Air Force One and his wounds secretly altered prior to the 8:00 PM Bethesda autopsy has been "more than fully validated".
Reprise: Oh my goodness!!
How could anyone possibly believe such a thing?
I think rather than asking "Did it Happen?" or "How did it happen?", a much better question to ask when it comes to David S. Lifton's body-alteration theory would be this one:
Given all of the obvious roadblocks and complications involved in such a covert chore, is it even remotely possible that it COULD have happened?
And I think the answer to that last question is a most resounding and definitive "No" (as discussed in detail at the link below).
In other words, what once seemed crazy....is still very very crazy (not to mention impossible).
GARY MURR SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
According to David Lifton's hilariously absurd theory centering on the activity of the Secret Service agents in the immediate aftermath of the assassination (which is discussed by Lifton in the 2013 video embedded below), SS agent John Ready "threw himself" into the Presidential limousine after the shooting, and (according to Lifton) it is Ready's foot we see sticking out of the back seat of the car in the David Miller photograph.
Also....
Quoting Lifton in 2013: "He [John Connally] got shot as a result of this fight in the car [with Secret Service agent John Ready]."
So now we know how David Lifton managed to keep John Connally from sustaining any wounds from the rear during the period when the assassination of JFK was taking place on Elm Street. He (Lifton) merely invented this fantasy story about Secret Service agent John Ready leaping into the limousine and shooting Connally. And then John Connally, in all of his many post-1963 interviews, decided to never once mention this "fight" that he had with Ready.
GARY MURR SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I can, indeed, understand why you [Gary Murr] wouldn't want to be dragged into David Lifton's increasingly bizarre "charade" (as you put it).
It would be nice, though, if Mr. Lifton's "Final Charade" book could somehow manage to get published (if the full manuscript still survives, that is). I would enjoy reading about all of the many additional fantasy theories that David L. had talked himself into believing during the last 40 years of his life.
Many of those outer-fringe fantasies are revealed by David Lifton himself in
this 14-part, 3-hour-long video series which he made in late 2013. But I'm guessing that during the 9 years between 2013 and the time of his death in December of 2022, Mr. Lifton very likely was able to concoct at least a few more outlandish episodes concerning the events of 11/22/63. Perhaps, say, a new baseless theory about how Officer Tippit died on Tenth Street. Lifton, after all, did not believe that Lee Oswald committed that murder either (see the very end of Part 10 of Lifton's video series).
So maybe Lifton can pretend that Domingo Benavides pulled a gun out of his truck on 10th Street and shot Tippit; or—just possibly—Lifton can get Helen Markham to play the part of Tippit's killer. Because, after all, with David S. Lifton in control of the fiction that he puts down on the pages of his fantasy books, just about anything is likely to happen, and just about anybody can be a suspect in the murders that took place in Dallas on November 22, 1963.
Hey, if Secret Service agent John Ready can be the person who shot Connally, why couldn't waitress Helen Markham be a cop killer?
DAVID VON PEIN LATER SAID:
BTW / FWIW....
Concerning the question of whether or not David Lifton's long-awaited book "Final Charade" will ever be published:
I noticed the following comment attached to one of the videos on the "David Lifton On JFK" YouTube channel. The person who replied (@davidliftononjfk2724) apparently was doing so on behalf of Lifton and his YouTube channel. That person was certainly logged-in to Lifton's YouTube channel at any rate. So, maybe Final Charade will end up seeing the light of day after all.
I captured this image on February 3rd, 2024:
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Yes, Jim, that's about the size of it (according to Mr. Lifton).
I'm not really sure, though, what difference it makes whether Connally was shot from the "front" or the "rear" in Lifton's fantasy version of that shooting. The "front vs. rear" trajectory thing seems kind of moot and totally unimportant via a scenario which is supposedly taking place only after the car has already left Dealey Plaza.
But the "Ready Shot Connally" fairy tale was obviously invented by Lifton sometime after he had decided he had to find a way to keep both limo victims from being hit by shots fired from the TSBD. And he had to do that because he had already decided that Oswald was merely firing "blanks" at JFK's car from the Depository. (See Part 10 of Lifton's video series to enjoy the full thrust of Mr. Lifton's "Oswald Fired Blanks" make-believe fantasy.)
FRANCOIS CARLIER SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Re: Lifton's book....
I too have heard that Lifton's book manuscript was "lost" in a computer hard drive crash. But I find it very hard to believe that Mr. Lifton would have had his manuscript stored in only one location. His "Final Charade" project was obviously extraordinarily valuable to him personally, which would mean (I would think) that he would certainly have wanted to have at least one back-up copy stored somewhere in his digital files. (And probably more than one back-up. I currently have everything on my computer backed up on two different external hard drives---just in case.)
It's hard for me to believe that someone as meticulous with his written posts as David Lifton would have been so careless as to rely on merely one digital source for his very precious "Final Charade" material.
I'm guessing there are some "back ups" to be found---somewhere.
AARON SHARPE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Yes, but it's not an altogether unheard of thing to have a major book release being delayed for a number of years. The same thing happened to Vince Bugliosi, whose very large JFK book, then titled "Final Verdict", was originally scheduled to appear in book stores on November 22, 1998 (and at that time it was a "mere" 992 pages long; CLICK HERE). But it took another 9 years for the book, which more than doubled in size, to finally appear as "Reclaiming History".
So a 10- or 15-year delay in publishing a huge JFK tome like David Lifton's last book doesn't surprise me at all.
Here's a 2010 Usenet Forum post by Francois Carlier which says that Lifton's "Final Charade" was supposed to be published in June of 2007, which would have been just one month after Bugliosi's JFK book came out.
So David was working on that book for quite a long time. And by 2022, the number of pages it encompassed surely must have reached well into four digits, probably rivaling Bugliosi's final page count of 2,824 (which includes all of the endnotes and the 32 pages of photographs).
CLIFF VARNELL SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
There was no "throat shot" at all, of course. Because if there had been such a shot, at least one bullet (and probably two) would have been plucked from JFK's body at the autopsy. But no whole bullets were found in his body.
The "throat shot" is (and always has been) a fantasy invented by conspiracy theorists.
David Von Pein
February 2-9, 2024
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ROBERT MORROW SAID THIS.
GREG DOUDNA SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Why on Earth can't it be a "real description" of the sixth-floor assassin??? Of course it was a "real description" of the assassin.
Here's a discussion I had with a couple of conspiracy believers in 2015 concerning this same (general) topic....
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DVP SAID:
One of the many things that conspiracy theorists will always refuse to evaluate properly is the fact that Howard Brennan provided a description of the 6th-floor assassin on Day 1 (November 22) in his affidavit that generally fits Lee Oswald.
Even the age of the assassin Brennan saw fits perfectly with Marrion Baker's incorrect estimate of Lee Oswald's age -- about 30 -- which we know is wrong, but we also know that the man Baker described as being "approximately 30 years old" WAS Lee Harvey Oswald and not somebody who could have merely been confused with Oswald.
And then there are the "weight" estimates provided by Brennan and Baker in their individual affidavits, which also (just like the "age" estimate) blend together perfectly:
Baker said -- "165 pounds".
Brennan said -- "165 to 175 pounds".
And, just like Baker's estimate for Oswald's age, the weight estimate he provided in his affidavit is wrong, but we still know that Baker was estimating the weight of the real Lee Harvey Oswald when he wrote down "165 pounds" in his 11/22/63 affidavit.
Ergo, we know that it is, indeed, possible for a person to look right at Lee Harvey Oswald on November 22, 1963, and think he weighed as much as 165 pounds. Shouldn't this fact mean just a little something to CTers when they attempt to assess whether or not Howard Brennan could have possibly seen Oswald in the Sniper's Nest on that same day?
Do CTers think that Baker and Brennan got together and swapped information so that their affidavits would merge perfectly with respect to both the "age" and "weight" estimates?
A CONSPIRACY THEORIST KNOWN AS "NICKNAME" SAID:
Brennan's testimony does your case no good, unfortunately. He recalls seeing "a white man, early 30's, slender, weight about 165 to 175 pounds." As if that description doesn't fit 40 million people. Add that he was 120 feet away, staring at a figure six stories up. Could you positively ID someone from that distance? And even if it was Oswald he saw, that only proves that Oswald was ONE OF the shooters, not the only shooter.
DVP SAID:
NickName,
Read my last post again, and place Brennan's 11/22 affidavit alongside Baker's 11/22 affidavit. Can't you see the similarities?
And, as I said, we know for an absolute irrefutable fact that Marrion Baker was describing Lee Harvey Oswald in that affidavit and nobody else on Earth. And yet he made the same TWO incorrect estimates that Howard Brennan also made -- age and weight.
And you surely aren't going to pull a DiEugenio on me and claim something silly like this (are you?)....
"Baker never saw Oswald. .... I believe the [Oswald/Baker/Truly] incident was created after the fact." -- James DiEugenio; July 13-14, 2015
GARRY PUFFER SAID:
A guy who weighs 141 pounds would never be said to weigh 165.
DVP SAID:
Tell that to Marrion L. Baker of the Dallas Police Department, Garry....
"The man I saw was a white man approximately 30 years old, 5'9", 165 pounds." -- M.L. Baker; November 22, 1963
Let me guess, Garry --- Marrion Baker wasn't really describing the real Lee Harvey Oswald when he said the man he stopped at gunpoint in the Depository's second-floor lunchroom weighed "165 pounds", right? You think Baker was either lying or he was describing somebody besides Oswald (despite the fact Roy Truly, who was right there in the lunchroom with Baker during the encounter, confirmed it was Lee Oswald). Right?
Let's hear the CTers' lame, rip-roaring, half-baked excuse for totally dismissing these words written by Roy Truly on 11/23/63:
"The officer and I went through the shipping department to the freight elevator. We then started up the stairway. We hit the second floor landing, the officer stuck his head into the lunch room area where there are Coke and candy machines. Lee Oswald was in there. The officer had his gun on Oswald and asked me if he was an employee. I answered yes." -- Roy S. Truly; November 23, 1963
HANK SIENZANT SAID:
Great post, David.
DVP SAID:
Thanks, Hank.
I like to keep this "Assassination Arguments Part 1000" page handy whenever somebody tells me that it would have been utterly impossible for any witness to think Lee Oswald weighed as much as 165 pounds.
[End 2015 Quotes.]
GREG DOUDNA SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Yes....it was coincidence. Without doubt (IMO).
It's a coincidence brought about by Howard Brennan's description of the assassin that he gave to the police (probably to J. Herbert Sawyer).
But maybe Bob Morrow thinks that Brennan was in cahoots with Marguerite on the "5-feet-10, 165 pounds" thing. After all, anything's possible in the bizarre conspiracy-flavored world inhabited by many CTers. 😛
ROBERT MORROW SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Typical CTer mindset.
IOW -- The More Liars, The Better.
GREG DOUDNA SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Some of my thoughts on the "Brennan/Sawyer" matter can be found HERE.
And here are some excerpts from Vincent Bugliosi's book pertaining to Brennan and Sawyer (click to enlarge)....
David Von Pein
February 5, 2024
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JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
In order to keep the idea of a nonexistent conspiracy alive in the Walker and JFK shootings, James DiEugenio, as usual, will ignore the obvious and clear answers to the questions he posed above.
IOW --- Different day....same old worn-out CTer crap. Yawn.
GREG DOUDNA SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Oh, how right you are with the above remarks, Greg. It's nice to know that are at least a few conspiracy believers who haven't fallen for the absurd and preposterous "Ruth Paine Was A Conspirator" claptrap. I applaud your comments in this thread, Gregory Doudna.
David Von Pein
February 19-21, 2024
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DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
It's more than sixty years later, and yet this headline from page 2 of the December 1, 1963, edition of my hometown newspaper is still as valid and correct as it was back in 1963 (despite the opinions of the many conspiracy theorists who believe otherwise) —— "Evidence Does Not Support Theory
Of Oswald Conspiracy" (click to enlarge)....
DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:
A section of the above 12/1/63 Associated Press newspaper article that I found particularly interesting is the excerpt pictured below, which reveals the results of some rapid-fire rifle tests performed in Los Angeles that closely match the Carcano rifle firing tests that were done by the HSCA more than a decade later in 1978:
"The [House Select] Committee test fired a Mannlicher-Carcano rifle using the open iron sights. It found that it was possible for two shots to be fired within 1.66 seconds." -- HSCA Final Report; Page 83
Which means, via the HSCA tests, that three shots could be fired in a total time span of just 3.3 seconds.
David Von Pein
February 19, 2024
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DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
As I say goodbye to the alt.conspiracy.jfk Usenet newsgroup [more info here], a place where I have posted for the last 20 years (2004—2024), I thought it would be a good idea to go out by posting a flurry of handy and valuable JFK Assassination links (all of them my sites), just in case any lurkers who might drop by this newsgroup in the year 2525 have a desire to read many arguments which prove beyond all reasonable doubt that Lee Harvey Oswald murdered President John F. Kennedy and Dallas Police Officer J.D. Tippit on November 22, 1963.
| List of links -----> |  |
David Von Pein
February 21, 2024
