JFK ASSASSINATION ARGUMENTS
(PART 1240)


BEN HOLMES SAID:

David [Von Pein] makes the claim [here] that the "best medical evidence" was that a "thru-and-thru transiting bullet went through JFK's neck."

But this is a lie on his part - as THERE WAS NO MEDICAL EVIDENCE **WHATSOEVER** for this claim. (Nor will David cite any...)

Indeed, the prosectors claim not to have EVEN KNOWN about the throat wound, and were forbidden from dissecting the track of the wounds... so there's ZERO medical evidence for transit.

David cannot cite any evidence for transit. It doesn't exist.

IT DOESN'T EXIST!!!

What he's able to cite IS OPINION BASED ON SPECULATION MADE AFTER THE AUTOPSY WAS OVER.

Nor can David make a bullet striking T3/T4 come out the neck... it *IS* impossible given what we know about where David alleges the bullet came from, and the position of JFK at the time.

This is why the Warren Commission artificially RAISED the wound... with their God-like powers... "Let the wound be raised... and it was raised..."

David is a coward, and will NOT respond to this post, point by point, as I frequently do with his posts.

He can't.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

The mere FACT that there WAS NO BULLET FOUND IN JFK'S WHOLE BODY is a solid indication the bullet transited his body. Ben will deny that obvious assertion forever, I guess. But it's still true.

There's also the OUTWARD-POINTING fibers in JFK's shirt which certainly are indicative of the bullet EXITING the throat, not ENTERING it.

As for the Warren Commission "moving" the wound up to the neck....Click Here.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

My crystal ball was, yep, you guessed it, right AGAIN!

David was completely unable to cite any medical evidence WHATSOEVER for transit.

Nor was he honest enough to publicly admit that he cannot...


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

It would help, Ben, if you possessed just a TINY bit of ability to properly and reasonably evaluate the evidence in this case. You have not exhibited any ability to perform such an important task. So until you do garner such ability, you are destined to forever remain lost in a sea of piecemeal and isolated evidence and theories.

Quick Summary....

1. Bullet hits JFK in upper back.

2. No bullet found in JFK's body at autopsy.

3. There's a bullet hole in the front of JFK's throat.

4. The fibers in JFK's shirt are pointing OUTWARD.

5. The bruising pattern in JFK's upper body suggests the PASSAGE of a high-speed missile caused those bruises.

6. The autopsy report, signed by 3 doctors, says this:

"The missile contused the strap muscles of the right side of the neck, damaged the trachea and made its exit through the anterior surface of the neck. As far as can be ascertained this missile struck no bony structures in its path through the body."

7. Governor Connally's injuries also suggest the high likelihood that the bullet that exited JFK's neck went on to pierce Connally's upper back as well.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

It would help, David, if you possessed just a TINY bit of courage to address and explain the evidence in this case.

But you don't.

TIME AND TIME AGAIN I demonstrate your cowardice and lying.

OVER AND OVER you refuse to defend yourself - you can't!

[...]

The Warren Commission quite dishonestly moved it [the bullet wound in JFK's back] semantically to the lower neck.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Bullshit. They did no such thing, and CE903 proves they didn't. Specter places the wound in the upper BACK here, not the NECK. This one exhibit (CE903), more than anything else, proves the CTers are dead wrong when they insist the Warren Commission needed the wound in the NECK....




BEN HOLMES SAID:

"No bullet found in JFK's body at autopsy." [DVP]

At the official autopsy starting at 8 pm, no.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Which was the ONLY autopsy, of course. Ben is imagining additional autopsies. (What a silly hobby.)


BEN HOLMES SAID:

Indeed there is [a bullet hole in the front of JFK's throat] - one that wasn't known about by the prosectors, and never examined at the autopsy.

And you know quite well that the Warren Commission lied about this wound, as well as Vincent Bugliosi. Believers are just SCARED TO DEATH about the throat wound - since it proves that there was a conspiracy.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Even though the OFFICIAL AUTOPSY REPORT plainly indicates the throat wound was an EXIT wound.

Just continue to ignore that fact, Ben. Your hobby requires that you ignore it.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

I've already pointed out that you're lying. You CONTINUE to refuse to cite the underlying evidence for this claim....

"The fibers in JFK's shirt are pointing OUTWARD."

....because you *KNOW* that you're lying.

Nor will you dare mention the examination made to find copper - which *WAS* found in the clothing from the back wound... and not found at all in the slit made by a scalpel when removing the tie.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Ben is imagining "lies" being told (by me and the Warren Commission). Lies that never existed, of course.

The FACT is that the front of JFK's shirt had fibers POINTING OUTWARD, indicating the bullet exited the throat:

ROBERT A. FRAZIER (FBI) -- "...the fibers of the cloth are protruding outward, that is, have been pushed from the inside out. I could not actually determine from the characteristics of the hole whether or not it was caused by a bullet. However, I can say that it was caused by a projectile of some type which exited from the shirt at that point and that is again assuming that when I first examined the shirt it was--it had not been altered from the condition it was in at the time the hole was made."


BEN HOLMES SAID:

"The bruising pattern in JFK's upper body suggests the PASSAGE of a high-speed missile caused those bruises." [DVP]

Nope. Simply untrue.

Nor can you cite the photo showing this bruising - it's one of the bits of evidence that simply disappeared while under government control.

Most likely because it would have PROVEN that there wasn't any transit.

If the photo supported transit, there'd have been no reason to make it disappear.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

The autopsy report and the testimony of the autopsy doctors is enough PROOF for me. But you think everybody connected with JFK's autopsy was a liar, so naturally you aren't able to reasonably evaluate the bruises. Such is the life of a rabid conspiracist.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

But you don't *BELIEVE* the autopsy report, do you David?

I've repeatedly pointed this out - AND YOU ABSOLUTELY **REFUSE** TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT YOU ACCEPT THE AUTOPSY REPORT.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

It's my opinion that just ONE WORD is likely inaccurate in the whole report -- the word "occipital" in the "Missile Wounds" section on Page 3 of the autopsy report.

More on that topic here.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

This [quote from JFK's autopsy report] isn't based on any examination of the body....

"The missile contused the strap muscles of the right side of the neck, damaged the trachea and made its exit through the anterior surface of the neck. As far as can be ascertained this missile struck no bony structures in its path through the body."

....this is opinion based on speculation formed after the autopsy.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

It's a conclusion based on EVERYTHING the autopsy doctors saw on 11/22/63 PLUS the new information obtained by Dr. Humes from Dr. Perry on Saturday morning. The ONLY logical conclusion to reach after assessing EVERYTHING was to conclude exactly what Humes & Company did conclude --- the bullet went clear through Kennedy's body.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

Until the prosectors 'learned' of the throat wound the following day, the autopsy report would have stated that the bullet striking the back only went in a short distance, then worked its way back out.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

So what? More information was obtained on Saturday, which made the answer quite obvious to Humes and his associates.

Why do you think ALL THREE doctors signed off on the transiting bullet? Were they ALL liars (or idiots)? Nonsense.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

The evidence simply doesn't support your claim [re: the Single-Bullet Theory and Governor Connally's injuries], and you know it.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Bull. The SBT works perfectly from every angle, as I demonstrate here:




BEN HOLMES SAID:

Believers don't believe in utilizing the most plausible explanation... the evidence *CLEARLY* conflicts, and the simple explanation is there ready for them to accept... but they don't.


BUD SAID:

You [Ben Holmes] slide down a slippery slope, grasping at one fantastic concept after another until your ideas are crushed by the weight of the fantastic. Which is why you will never put your ideas on the table for examination, the absurdity of them would become instantly apparent.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

Said the coward who refuses to post his scenario...

And refuses to answer simple questions...


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

You don't think Bud has ever posted his "scenario" of the JFK assassination? You must be nuts.

Bud's scenario has been on the table for decades. And it's the same as mine....

Oswald fired three shots with his Carcano from the 6th floor of the TSBD, striking the President twice, with one of those "strikes" also hitting Governor Connally. No conspiracy. Just Oswald. Period.


BEN HOLMES SAID:

GOOD!!!

It's always amusing when I can get a believer to answer a simple question.

And since you've provided your scenario, I'll do EXACTLY WHAT I'VE REPEATEDLY STATED I WILL DO - which is to provide a scenario EXACTLY as detailed, and with JUST AS MUCH EVIDENCE cited as you do.

At least three shooters fired multiple weapons from at least three different directions, striking the President three times, and striking Connally at least twice, and probably three times. Clearly a conspiracy. Oswald was not a shooter. Period.

Now, the next time you or "Bud" or any other believer tries to claim that I've not provided a scenario - *YOU* will know that you or they are lying, won't you?


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

No wonder you didn't want to post your scenario earlier. It's embarrassingly silly.

Poor Ben.

Just imagine the "at least three shooters" all taking aim at JOHN KENNEDY'S body (with none of them aiming at JOHN CONNALLY, of course; only an idiot would think that any shots were aimed at Connally) --- and the end result of all this AIMING AT KENNEDY is that CONNALLY is hit AS MANY TIMES WITH BULLETS as JFK was (per Holmes' insane scenario).

Hi-lar-ious!


DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:

Do you, Ben, think the "at least three shooters" in Dealey Plaza were PROFESSIONAL ASSASSINS? Or were they merely three guys with guns who were chosen at random off the street to do the job by the Grand Poobah Of Assassinations?


BEN HOLMES SAID:

Tut tut tut, David...

I gave you a RECENT example where a shooter, FAR CLOSER TO HIS INTENDED VICTIM THAN OCCURRED IN DEALEY PLAZA, still ended up shooting two unintended victims.

You should publicly acknowledge that you've been schooled.

*THEN*... and only then, can you ask more questions.


DAVID VON PEIN SAID:

Once more I want lurkers to just envision the kind of "professional assassination" plot that most CTers believe in --- THREE shooters all taking aim at JFK. (And why there was even a NEED for "at least three shooters" is yet another discussion; it's ridiculous overkill, of course, and would only serve to TRIPLE the chances that the shooters would be caught and/or exposed.)

And yet, per Ben, these THREE shooters ("at least"; maybe even four, five, or sixty gunmen, per Kook Ben), all presumably PRO killers, pelt an unintended victim (Connally) with just as many bullets as the intended victim (3 apiece).

Remind me to never again hire any of those "at least three shooters" for my next Presidential hit in the future. Their performance could hardly have been worse (as far as hitting ONLY the target, that is).

It's remarkable that Skinny Holland, Jean Hill, Ike Altgens, and Jesse Curry got out of Dealey Plaza alive, what with the "three blind mice" wielding the guns that day.

David Von Pein
April 3, 2017
April 12, 2017
April 13, 2017
April 13, 2017