JFK ASSASSINATION ARGUMENTS
DAVE REITZES SAID:
LNers who used to be CTers?
A lot of people here are probably aware that I used to believe (rather vehemently, as a matter of fact) that JFK was killed by a conspiracy and no longer do.
Who else at this forum has gone this route?
JOHN CORBETT SAID:
Count [me] in.
STEVE THOMAS SAID:
I'm about 85 percent there. I still think there could have been a conspiracy, but until/unless something new and BIG comes out, it's looking more like Oswald could have done it alone. There are still things I find hard to believe in both CT and LN versions though.
JEAN DAVISON SAID:
Rush to Judgment was the first book I read, and I fell for it. Years ago I wrote an article arguing for four shots, based on eyewitness testimony. Fortunately, I wasn't able to get it published. Could that be the biggest difference between LNs and CTs -- the weight given to witness statements?
DAVE REITZES SAID:
I'd say that LNs tend to be more impressed by hard evidence and expert testimony, while CTs tend to be persuaded by lay interpretations of forensic evidence, eyewitness testimony, speculation, hearsay, rumor, and innuendo.
SANDY McCROSKEY SAID:
For many years I accepted the notion that there was a conspiracy. I started to second-guess the claims for it after the Oliver Stone movie came out and critics did some fact-checking.
PAT SPEER SAID:
How about CTs who used to be LNers? Now that's a small group.
I saw [Oliver Stone's] JFK like everyone else and was intrigued by the idea there was a conspiracy, but not convinced. 10 years or so later I read Case Closed and was 95% convinced there was no conspiracy. I decided, however, to check out some of Posner's claims before firmly committing myself to one position. One thing that particularly bothered me was that the SBT drawings of JFK and Connally in Posner's book distorted their body shapes to make the wounds align. This led me to start reading about Posner's book on the internet. I soon realized there were many other deceptions in his book.
What pushed me to the CT side, however, was Lattimer's SBT drawing. That drawing is the single-most ridiculous and embarrassing exhibit I've ever seen, and yet many--perhaps the majority--of those holding Oswald fired the shots, find it compelling, and argue for its accuracy.
JOHN CORBETT SAID:
If the Posner and Lattimer diagrams of the bullet path are not to your liking, is there a bullet trajectory that does satisfy you? If so, what is the path of the bullet after it leaves JFK's throat? How does it miss JBC? Does it go left, right, or over JBC? Or is there another possibility?
The problem with trying to diagram the path of the SBT is that you are trying to represent a 3-dimensional event in two dimensions. You are faced with that limitation no matter what perspective you diagram the bullet path from. That is why I have been most impressed with Dale Myers' work. He shows the bullet trajectory in a virtual 3-D world which can be viewed from any perspective. It shows the SBT works.
I will continue to believe in the SBT until someone develops a more credible theory of the path of the bullet that went threw JFK's neck. If it didn't hit Connally, what happened to it? The SBT is the lynchpin of the single assassin theory. Without it, there had to be two shooters. The SBT is as sound today as when it was first developed by the WC. It is the result of rock solid deductive reasoning. The fact that no one in 46 years has been able to develop a reasonable alternative is a testament to that.
After seeing the Zapruder film for the first time, I was convinced the shot came from the front right. My reaction was how could the authorities be so stupid as to not realize this after looking at this film? However, after reading a lot more about the case, I realized it was my ignorance of ballistics that was the problem.
ANTHONY MARSH SAID:
WC defenders try their phony Argument by Authority, but they never produce the evidence, only lies.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The evidence has been on the table since '63. Tony Marsh, like all conspiracy theorists, just refuses to accept it. It's as simple (and silly) as that.
But, naturally, Anthony Marsh and his cohorts in conspiracyville will continue to twist in the wind and invent anti-SBT theories and other unsupportable works of fiction and fantasy to keep from facing the "Oswald Did It By Himself" truth, even though a perfectly good and reasonable "SBT" is already on the table, thanks to the Warren Commission's work.
The HSCA's Z190 timeline is ridiculous, but at least they acknowledged the obvious fact that one bullet--CE399--wounded both JFK and John B. Connally, and that was the most important bottom-line conclusion for the House Select Committee to reach, regardless of the exact timing for that SBT shot.
CTers, of course, want to believe that not only did the Warren Commission get things all fouled up with respect to CE399 and the SBT, but the HSCA (14 years later and with a totally DIFFERENT group of investigators!) ALSO got it all wrong too, because the HSCA also said that that exact bullet--CE399--was THE BULLET that went through the bodies of both President Kennedy and Governor Connally.
How many official investigations would it take to convince any of the conspiracy kooks of the validity of the Single-Bullet Theory and Commission Exhibit No. 399? Four? Five? Six investigations perhaps? I wonder.
More conspiracy believers should really watch the first-day and second-day TV coverage from November 22 and 23, 1963. It blows the various "multi-gun plots" to bits, and strongly suggests (to the point of virtual verification after Day 1) three very crucial things:
1.) Three shots (and only three shots) were fired during the assassination of President Kennedy in Dealey Plaza.
2.) There was only ONE person shooting at JFK.
3.) Lee Harvey Oswald was shooting at JFK.
The math's pretty easy when you've got all three of the above things staring you in the face.
And the six DPD hallway interviews given by Dallas Police Chief Jesse Curry (video below) pretty much seal the deal on Oswald's guilt, right down to Curry's November 23rd hallway announcement that the DPD had just received word from the FBI that "the order letter" for the murder weapon (the C2766 Mannlicher-Carcano rifle) was filled out in the handwriting of "our suspect--Oswald".
So, just 24 hours after the assassination, the Dallas Police Department and the FBI had Lee Oswald tied to the President's murder in various highly incriminating ways. Let's take a look at just a few of them:
1.) It was HIS (Oswald's) rifle.
2.) HIS (Oswald's) palmprint was lifted off the gun by Lt. J.C. Day of the Dallas Police Department. (Lt. Day stated to the Warren Commission that he was reasonably certain right from the get-go that the palmprint he lifted off of Rifle C2766 was Oswald's print [see 4 H 262]. That print was later conclusively proven by the FBI to be Oswald's palmprint.)
3.) By the afternoon of November 23, multiple witnesses had already identified HIM (Oswald) as J.D. Tippit's killer.
4.) It was HIS (Oswald's) handwriting on "the order letter" [Curry's 11/23/63 words] that was filled out by LHO and mailed to Klein's
Sporting Goods in March '63.
5.) And it was OSWALD who was fighting like a wild man and pulling a gun on the police in the Texas Theater just 80 minutes after JFK was killed on a street that was just yards away from where HE (Oswald) worked.
6.) Plus: the DPD also knew as of 11/22/63 and 11/23/63 that HE (Oswald) was positively INSIDE THE BUILDING at about 12:32 PM, which was just two minutes after the President was killed from that very same building (the TSBD).
Yes, indeed, more conspiracy theorists should take advantage of these videos which show what was happening in Dallas and at City Hall--live, as it was occurring--on November 22 and 23.
If the cops were "covering up" a bunch of evidence in the murder cases of JFK and J.D. Tippit and were engaging in a plot to frame an innocent patsy named Lee Harvey Oswald THAT QUICKLY on Friday and Saturday (as many conspiracy theorists seem to believe), then they did an outstanding job of "framing" him -- because just about every single thing we see in those videos is spelling out "Oswald's guilty of two murders".
David Von Pein
May 5, 2010
Posted By: David Von Pein
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