Part 1365 of my "JFK Assassination Arguments" series includes a variety of my posts and comments covering the period of June 1—30, 2023. To read the entire forum discussion from which my own comments have been extracted, click on the "Full Discussion" logo at the bottom of each individual segment.
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
So, the thing you say is an "obvious entry wound" in the Stare Of Death autopsy photograph was somehow completely missed (or ignored?) by all of the autopsy physicians?
How can anyone truly believe such a thing?
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
And your proof that the autopsy was "falsified" is......?
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I asked for your proof that the autopsy was "falsified". You provided nothing but your opinion.
Wanna try again?
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
But the autopsy findings are completely CONSISTENT with the BEST AUTOPSY EVIDENCE there is---the autopsy photographs and X-rays.
And, I see that the ultra-silly "wrong brain" myth refuses to die too. ~sigh~
DAVE CHRISMAN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
[Quoting Dr. Robert McClelland....]
"Some people have even said 'Oh, that tracheostomy has been altered; it's too big a wound'. Well, I can speak for that -- no, it had not been altered. That's exactly the way it was made at Parkland. It's just that people expected it to be smaller." -- Dr. Robert N. McClelland; Via this 2009 interview (at 41:25)
David Von Pein
June 1-2, 2023
================================
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID THIS.
MARK ULRIK SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Along these same "grammar" lines....
In his latest two-part essay on Pacino & Travolta, I see that Jim DiEugenio still hasn't managed to correct his persistent habit of misspelling the word it's as its (sans the apostrophe). (See Part 2 of the article for multiple examples.)
I've noticed in recent months that multiple other Education Forum members (besides just Jim D.) also have that same habit of refusing to spell that particular word correctly. Which seems very curious to me. Is Jim's longtime grammar affliction contagious? 😁
JOHN COTTER SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Oh, I assure you, I didn't read any of the two-part article. (~Shuddering at the thought.~)
I merely searched both parts and used the handy "Word Find" tool to search for "its" and "it's". That's all.
MARK ULRIK SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The "Vocative comma" and the dreaded "Comma immediately following a sentence-opening prepositional phrase" are things that I have been advocating and fully supporting for years now. 😇
In fact, when I was proofreading the text of the book I helped Mel Ayton write a few years back, I had the darndest time convincing Mel that many additional commas were needed in our manuscript before it went to press. I succeeded in getting most of them added.
For some odd reason, it seems that there is a paucity of commas being utilized in books written by many British authors (like Mr. Ayton). I've yet to figure out why this is so. ~shrug~
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Many people (numbering in the millions) disagree very strongly with your above assessment [that Jim DiEugenio is the "ultimate JFK Truth warrior"].
RON BULMAN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Yes, Ron, you're probably correct on this point (re: the "millions").
Let me revise my previous quote (so that it's technically more accurate):
"Many people (including virtually everybody who was an integral part of the Warren Commission and the HSCA and the Clark Panel and the Rockefeller Commission) disagree very strongly with your above assessment [that Jim DiEugenio is the "ultimate JFK Truth warrior"]."
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
And, along those same lines....
Anybody will believe anything they see on the movie theater screen---if it's an Oliver Stone production.
Sad, isn't it?
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
A quick reminder and Reality Check (re: some of the ridiculous things that are endorsed as the truth in the JFK case by James DiEugenio, who is a person that W. Niederhut just referred to as one of the "most knowledgeable people on the planet"):
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I certainly agree with you on this one, Jim. It most definitely is baloney.
That's almost as bad as this theory (discussed at another forum), in which an outer-fringe conspiracy nutjob informed me that J.D. Tippit was really killed in Dealey Plaza, instead of on 10th Street, and that the "staged shooting" on Tenth Street came complete with "conspiracy-supplied witnesses".
As the years pass, the number of conspiracy-happy clowns with really oddball theories seems to grow and grow.
David Von Pein
June 1, 2023
================================
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
PAT SPEER SAID THIS.
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
GEORGE GOVUS SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
But Mr. Simkin was simply wrong. As Pat Speer has already correctly pointed out in this discussion, the "printing error" concerning frames Z314 and Z315 of the Zapruder Film had nothing to do with LIFE Magazine's 11/29/63 issue. Instead, it had to do with a printing error in Warren Commission Exhibit No. 885.
Those two Z-Film frames (Z314-315) are printed in reverse order in CE885 (at 18 H 70-71).
Here's the portion of Vincent Bugliosi's JFK book, Reclaiming History, dealing with the subject of the "reversed Z-Film frames" (click to enlarge)....
Also see:
This April 6, 2016, Education Forum post written by David Lifton pertaining to the "printing error" referred to by FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover.
David Von Pein
June 2, 2023
================================
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The most "absurd" assertion made by conspiracy theorists at this forum (or any other) is the assertion that Vincent T. Bugliosi's "Reclaiming History" has (in any major way at all) been "debunked".
Such a notion concerning Bugliosi's mammoth 20-year effort is not only utterly laughable, but also provably wrong (based on the sum total of evidence in the JFK case).
BENJAMIN COLE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The Dictabelt junk has been debunked, yes. No doubt about it, IMO. At the very least, the HSCA/4th Shot/Dictabelt evidence has a very dark cloud hanging over it (based on Steve Barber's "Hold everything secure" discovery alone). And even most CTers should be able to acknowledge the existence of that "dark cloud". (See this webpage.)
Re: The smell of "Gunsmoke"....
The Smell Of Gunpowder In Dealey Plaza
Re: Bang....Bang-Bang....
The Spacing Of The Gunshots
Re: The SBT and Governor Connally's reactions....
The Ultimate In SBT Denial Among Conspiracy Theorists
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
If you want to believe that DiEugenio has "demolished" Vince Bugliosi's book, fine. But you're only fooling yourself. Because — newsflash! — the evidence in the John F. Kennedy murder case (laid out painstakingly by Bugliosi in his book) clearly establishes Lee Harvey Oswald's guilt---and very likely his lone guilt.
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Good Lord, what a load of garbage.
Only a person hell-bent on promoting a conspiracy in the JFK case (such as Jim DiEugenio) could possibly just brush aside the massive amounts of actual evidence presented by Vincent Bugliosi in "Reclaiming History" and categorize that huge pile of evidence as merely "a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, symbolizing nothing".
Mr. DiEugenio, you're living in a fantasy world.
W. NIEDERHUT SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The problem is --- the many things you and DiEugenio insist have been "debunked" really haven't been "debunked" at all. You guys just THINK they've been debunked. Big difference.
Take, for example, DiEugenio's constant refrain about the "wrong rifle". That's been fully explained (and reasonably so) in "LNer" (non-conspiratorial) terms, and Jim D. knows this full well. But he never stops with the "wrong rifle" crap. As if it has never once been reasonably explained before. And Bugliosi, of course, addresses the issue in his book (excerpted below). He doesn't ignore it or sweep it under the carpet (click to enlarge):
BTW....
Vince Bugliosi knew full well that the rifle wasn't found "in the sniper's nest", even though he says it was in the above book excerpt. That was merely an innocent mistake (even though some CTers might believe otherwise).
JAMES DiEUGENIO SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
From this July 2015 forum discussion....
DVP SAID:
In order for Vince [Bugliosi] to completely live up to his claim that he would present the case as the critics of the Warren Commission would present it, Vince would have had to touch base with every single CTer who has ever posted on the Internet (or who has ever written one of the hundreds of books on the case), because almost every CTer has at least a slightly different theory or approach to the evidence in the case.
A statement like Vince made -- "I intend to set forth all of their main arguments, and the way they, not I, want them to be set forth, before I seek to demonstrate their invalidity" [see the complete quote here] -- is a No Win situation for Vince, because there is always going to be some conspiracy theorist out there who will be able to say (after reading Bugliosi's book) -- "See, I told you so. Bugliosi's nothing but a liar! He didn't present THIS part of the case in the exact way I think it should have been presented, and therefore I get to call Vince a cheat and a liar."
It's impossible to please a JFK CTer. And by setting the bar so high with those words Vince used ("the way they, not I, want them to be set forth"), it became a hurdle that would have been just about impossible for Vince to overcome even if he had written 10,000 pages instead of just 2,800. But I, myself, think Vince did just fine in debunking virtually all of the major conspiracy theories connected with the JFK murder case. Many CTers, quite naturally, will vehemently disagree with me. Well, so be it. *
[* 2022 DVP EDIT -- But please also note the precise words that Bugliosi used in his book -- "I intend to set forth all of their main arguments..."
A key word there is the word "main".
Let me also add this important quote from Vince Bugliosi's book (regarding "wheat" and "chaff"):
"One of my very biggest tasks for you, the reader, was to separate the wheat from the chaff out of the virtually endless allegations, controversies, and issues surrounding the case. I believe I have done this, and it is this wheat, as it were, that constitutes this very long book." -- Vincent Bugliosi; Page xlv of "Reclaiming History"]
----------------------------------------
[End Quotes From 2015 & 2022.]
----------------------------------------
More about Vince Bugliosi's "pledge" HERE.
CHARLES BLACKMON SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The Neutron Activation Analysis (NAA) stuff is, indeed, "wheat" (IMO), but with an important asterisk and footnote after it.
Yes, Vince Bugliosi in his book did, indeed, put a lot of faith in the NAA analysis of Dr. Vincent Guinn. (And I, too, would like to know how the conspiracy theorists can possibly combat the "What Are The Odds?" logic and common
sense that reside in my 2007 article concerning Dr. Guinn's NAA conclusions, presented here.)
But I sure hope nobody has formed the incorrect opinion that Mr. Bugliosi just totally ignored the various NAA studies that have been published since 2002, which cast doubt on the exactitude of Dr. Guinn's determinations. Because Bugliosi certainly did not ignore those scientific studies at all. In fact, he talks about those newer NAA studies at some length in his book, a discussion which encompasses four entire pages of endnotes in "Reclaiming History". You can read all four of those pages here.
So, yes, Bugliosi did promote Dr. Guinn's NAA conclusions. But he also presented the opposing NAA viewpoint in his book as well.
David Von Pein
June 2-4, 2023
================================
GREG DOUDNA SAID [VIA AN E-MAIL MESSAGE]:
A 117-page study I have completed on the jackets of Oswald and analysis of the witnesses to Oswald’s clothing through the day of the assassination:
“Lee Harvey Oswald’s two jackets and why the Tippit killer’s jacket was not one of them”
The most important findings are that CE 162 was the Tippit killer’s abandoned jacket but was not Oswald’s gray jacket; and, in an inversion of the Warren Report’s reconstruction, Oswald first wore his gray jacket the morning of Fri Nov 22, then changed into his blue jacket (CE 163) at 1 p.m. at the rooming house and left with that. (The Warren Report argued the opposite sequence.)
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Greg's jacket theory, like most conspiracy theories, is just about the opposite of the truth and the known facts. Oswald's BLUE jacket was, of course, found in the TSBD's Domino Room in December 1963. And Earlene Roberts, in the Day 1 (11/22/63) KLIF Radio interview linked below, said that Oswald left the roominghouse on November 22nd wearing a "short gray coat", not a blue jacket.
(KLIF-Radio)(Thumbnail).png)
Also see the following excerpt from Vincent Bugliosi's book concerning the two jackets that Lee Oswald owned (click to enlarge):
GREG DOUDNA SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Thank you, Greg, for your last detailed post concerning your beliefs pertaining to Oswald's jackets. I can see that you've put a lot of time into creating that large 117-page report/essay on the jackets.
You're 100% wrong regarding the Jacket Charade (in my opinion), but your diligent effort to try and clear up any confusion concerning the jackets is certainly duly noted by yours truly.
Earlene Roberts, by the way, doesn't always refer to Oswald's outer garment as a "coat" (although, yes, she certainly did on Nov. 22 during her KLIF interview). But during her Warren Commission testimony, she referred to LHO's garment as a "jacket" as well.
And in case you're keeping a Jacket Scorecard, the official tally I came up with after looking through Mrs. Roberts' whole WC session is:
"Jacket" --- 5 references.
"Coat" --- 2 references.
In any event, regardless of which word Mrs. Roberts chose to use to describe the outer garment that Lee Harvey Oswald was wearing when he dashed out of his room in a hurry on November 22, 1963, the whole Jacket Charade that you, Greg Doudna, outline in such great detail in your lengthy article is something that is extremely unlikely to have occurred.
And the main reason the police wouldn't have wanted to play Musical Jackets with Oswald's garments is because they just simply didn't need to --- and that's because Lee Oswald still had the Tippit murder weapon on him when he was arrested in the Texas Theater. (Not to mention the multiple eyewitnesses who positively identified Oswald at or near the scene of Tippit's murder with a gun in his hands.)
So, given the fact the DPD knew they had the real killer of Officer Tippit in custody (namely: Lee Oswald), why the need to play Musical Jackets?
But, of course, since Greg Doudna doesn't think Lee Oswald killed J.D. Tippit at all (see Pages 44 and 117), that leaves open a wide variety of unsupportable theories that Greg can pluck from the sky in order to justify why the cops did this and did that.
That's what's so nice about being a conspiracy believer---there's almost nothing that can't be theorized. Even a needless Jacket Charade....and, of course, the switcheroo of the Tippit bullet shells (which is a must---if we're to believe Oswald didn't shoot J.D. Tippit).
I wonder if there is ANY evidence in the JFK & Tippit cases that an Internet conspiracy theorist thinks wasn't tampered with and/or manipulated by the authorities?
Greg Doudna has now added Oswald's two jackets to the list of "Fraudulent Evidence". (And as far as I can recall, that's the first time those two items have been labeled as "Fake" or "Tampered With" by any conspiracist.)
What's next? Oswald's wedding ring in the teacup?
David Von Pein
June 5, 2023
================================
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
On June 5, 2023, I added the following addendum to this article concerning Lee Harvey Oswald's rifle purchase:
We must also keep in mind this important fact....
The Klein's coupon that Lee Oswald used to order his rifle came from the February 1963 issue of American Rifleman magazine. But he didn't mail that order coupon until the middle of March. So by the time Oswald's rifle was shipped by Klein's (March 20), the April issue of American Rifleman (and other similar monthly magazines that had the Klein's ads in them) would have very likely already been on newsstands and in stores around the country.
And what was the length of the Italian Carbine that was being advertised by Klein's Sporting Goods in the April 1963 issue of American Rifleman magazine? Answer: 40 inches (per this e-mail that I received from Gary Mack in 2010).
Therefore, nobody should be at all surprised (not even a conspiracy theorist) that Lee Oswald was shipped a 40-inch Carcano rifle in late March of '63, since we know from the Klein's ads that the 40-inch version of the gun is the exact model (in addition to being the exact same price and catalog number) that Klein's customers would have been ordering and receiving through the mail (via the April issue of American Rifleman) at that exact same point in time—late March of 1963.
And since we know that Klein's definitely did switch from a 36-inch weapon to a 40-inch model in their advertisements in the early months of 1963, it stands to reason that a customer who technically ordered the 36-inch gun might receive the 40-inch model instead. And, in my opinion, that's just exactly what happened with Lee Harvey Oswald's rifle order. Plus, the fact that Oswald ordered his gun in the middle of March while using a February coupon made it even more likely that Klein's would have had to send him the 40-inch gun instead.
David Von Pein
June 5, 2023
================================
GREG PARKER SAID:
I am sensibly neither CT or LN and a have a whole subforum dedicated to debunking bad theories, no matter where they fall on your LN/CT chart.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I'll wait for the laughter to die down a bit before continuing.............
If Greg Parker was really "dedicated to debunking bad theories", then he should start with some of his own really bad ones, such as the one discussed here, in which Parker tries to make people believe that Lee Harvey Oswald never rented a room at 1026 North Beckley Avenue in Oak Cliff in October of 1963. (It'd be hard to beat that one on the "really bad" scale.)
And as for Greg Parker declaring that he's "neither CT or LN", let's take a quick look at a few of the comments he's made at various forums in past years and see if that fence-sitting position he says he occupies is backed up by his own statements....
"Those behind the hit didn't care what Oswald did. .... The idea seems to have been to toss someone to the DPD and let them do what they do best -- make (up) a case against their suspect." -- G. Parker; March 2019
That sure doesn't sound like a middle-of-the-road, fence-sitting statement to me.
Let's try a couple more....
"On balance, I don't believe Oswald carried a gun into the TT [Texas Theater]." .... and .... "That Baker/Truly/Oswald thing is pure, unadulterated bunk." -- G. Parker; March 2008
But remember everybody....Greg R. Parker is "neither CT or LN".
Yeah, right. And Donald Trump is a virtuous saint.
GREG PARKER SAID:
He [DVP] labelled this quote as "common sense"....
"What a sickening irony it is that this man who came through so much should die at the hands of a man worth so little." -- Alex Dreier; ABC News; November 22, 1963
Alex Dreier should hang his head in shame. So should [DVP].
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Why? It's an excellent / very excellent / super excellent quote. And oh so accurate.
You can argue that perhaps Mr. Dreier, on Day 1 (Nov. 22), shouldn't have been so blunt and definitive regarding the guilt of Oswald (aka: "a man worth so little"). But, then too, that particular quote is still an excellent (and entirely ACCURATE) quote even if somebody else besides Oswald had killed President Kennedy. It's only an inaccurate quote if the assassin had been a female. Because any man (be it Lee Oswald or Joe Schmoe or John Doe from Omaha) who kills an American President can aptly be described as a "man worth so little".
And if Greg Parker is offended in some way by the fact that I've propped up
Mr. Dreier's quote on my "Quoting Common Sense" website, that's just too damn bad. What could possibly matter less than the opinion of an outer-fringe conspiracy nutjob, who, in recent days and weeks, has established himself to be one of the most unpleasant and obnoxious individuals on the planet?
David Von Pein
June 5-6, 2023
================================
DAVID VON PEIN SAID THIS.
GIL JESUS SAID:
His [Marvin Johnson's] "fairly small package" isn't the 38-inch gunsack. It's the lunch sack from the chicken. He keeps referring to this as the "sack".
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
You're nuts. You think the LUNCH sack was "folded and refolded"? That was Johnson's description. He was obviously describing the GUN SACK, not any small lunch sack.
Plus:
DAVID BELIN -- Where would the sack have been found with reference to those vertical pipes? These vertical pipes, I believe, on the south side of the sixth floor near the east corner?
OFFICER MARVIN JOHNSON -- That sack would be over near the corner of the building here [pointing].
MR. BELIN -- Would all the sack be east of the pipes, or would part of the sack be sticking out west of the pipes?
MR. JOHNSON -- The way it was folded, it would all have to be over here.
MR. BELIN -- Your testimony then is that all the sack would have been east of the pipes. Is that correct?
MR. JOHNSON -- I would say that the sack was folded up here and it was east of the pipes in the corner.
-----------------
Again, Johnson is describing a sack/package that has been "FOLDED UP". That's not Bonnie Ray's lunch bag. No way.
In addition, it couldn't be more obvious that Johnson is talking about TWO different "sacks" during his Warren Commission session (at 7 H 102-103), because he says the lunch sack was found much further west than the larger gun sack, which he said was in the far southeast corner, near the pipes.
Plus, just look at the question that was posed by the WC's David Belin before Marvin Johnson ever said anything at all about the larger "folded" package. Belin prefaces his question by listing the various things that Johnson has already testified about---including the "lunch sack and the pop bottle by that second pair of windows"....
MR. BELIN -- Did you find anything else up in the southeast corner of the sixth floor? We have talked about the rifle, we have talked about the shells, we have talked about the chicken bones and the lunch sack and the pop bottle by that second pair of windows. Anything else?
MR. JOHNSON -- Yes, sir. We found this brown paper sack or case. It was made out of heavy wrapping paper. Actually, it looked similar to the paper that those books was wrapped in. It was just a long narrow paper bag.
MR. BELIN -- Where was this found?
MR. JOHNSON -- Right in the corner of the building. .... Sixth floor. .... Southeast corner.
http://jfk-assassination.net/Testimony Of Marvin Johnson
-----------------
Still think Marvin Johnson was talking ONLY about Bonnie Ray's lunch sack, Gil?
GIL JESUS SAID:
No physical evidence exists that supports the finding of the "gunsack" on the sixth floor.
And you've resorted once again to deception. Those crime scene photos you posted links to [HERE], you've taken someone else's interpretation of the pictures and presented them as fact.
You don't know if that 38-inch bag is in those pictures anymore than I do. You provide no evidence that the bag is depicted in those pics and no evidence to corroborate it.
And yet you present it as fact.
The reason why people don't want to engage you in debate over this case is because you never tell the whole story.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
You can SEE the long paper package on top of the boxes in CE508. And the various creases and folds pretty much match CE142.
But CTers will probably keep denying this gun sack ever existed (click for bigger views):
DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:
What probably happened was this:
The police picked up the gun sack before it ever got photographed (and yes, that was a mistake; it should have been photographed, but unfortunately it wasn't; but that doesn't mean it never existed).
Then, after picking up the gun sack (whether it be Montgomery or Studebaker who actually picked it up), it was put on top of the Sniper's Nest boxes, just a few feet from where it was picked up. It then inadvertently got photographed lying on top of the boxes in what became Commission Exhibit No. 508.
BUD SAID:
Blow-up of the corresponding photo in the Dallas History collection...Click Here.
I don't think that is the paper sack in CE508.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Oh, sure it is.
If it's not, it would be an incredible coincidence that this paper-like object (with a lot of folds and creases in it, just like the Oswald/CE142 bag) just happened to be photographed on the Sniper's Nest boxes on 11/22, a mere few feet from where CE142 was found.
What are the odds?
BUD SAID:
Sorry about that, I didn't follow the discussion closely, I didn't see where this was produced earlier. I thought you were talking about the item to the left in the photo. Yes, that appears to be the bag.
GIL JESUS SAID:
That paper could be anything.
You [DVP] are presenting your opinion as fact without any proof that that's what it is.
BUD SAID:
Where would your stupid hobby be without that?
DVP presented an idea and supported it. You don't like the idea because it is in conflict with your silly ideas.
BUD ALSO SAID:
Conspiracy hobbyists are poor thinkers as a rule, but it is thinking like this that puts Gil head and shoulders above the rest. He ignores the prints that are on the bag but finds prints not on the bag to be significant.
GIL JESUS SAID:
There's no evidence that what you're seeing in CE508 is THE gunsack. That's YOUR OPINION.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I'm making the reasonable inference that the paper object I see sitting on top of those boxes in CE508 is, indeed, the very same paper bag that we see in Warren Commission Exhibit No. 142.
This reasonable inference is strengthened significantly by my knowledge that a 38-inch paper bag (with various folds and creases in it) WAS definitely found by the police within just a few feet of where we see a long-ish paper object (which also has some folds and creases in it) resting on top of the Sniper's Nest boxes in Commission Exhibit 508.
My reasonable inference is also buttressed by the additional fact that the photo in CE508 was taken on the exact same day that the police found the 38-inch paper bag in the far southeast corner on the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository Building in Dallas, Texas, USA. That day being: Friday, November 22, 1963 AD.
But keep denying the "reasonable" nature of my above inference, Mr. Jesus. After all, that's what conspiracy theorists do best.
BTW / FWIW....
Here's the original 2019 online forum discussion concerning the "Paper Bag In CE508" discovery.
Interestingly enough, the fellow who first noticed the paper bag in the CE508 photograph (Patrick Jackson) seems to be a conspiracy believer, based on some of his other comments in the above-linked forum thread (such as in this post).
Lots more "Paper Bag" discussion HERE.
David Von Pein
June 6-8, 2023
================================
ADAM JOHNSON SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Here's the LIFE Magazine article you're looking for, Adam.....
http://books.google.com/LIFE Magazine/11-8-63/Bobby Baker Article
MICAH MILETO SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
No, Micah, I don't have a copy of the November 1983 LIFE Magazine. But if you've got 50 bucks to spare, you can buy a copy....
http://Original-Life-Magazines.com/November-1983
DAVID VON PEIN ALSO SAID:
FYI.....
Google Books is a fine resource for many complete copies of books and magazines, such as very old LIFE Magazine issues. But Google Books doesn't have anything online for LIFE Magazine newer than the year 1972.
Oldest LIFE edition (August 17, 1953) --- Click Here.
Newest LIFE edition (December 29, 1972) -- Click Here.
And (if you're interested)....I have a page on one of my JFK websites featuring 46 LIFE Magazine issues focusing on JFK and the Kennedy family (and I've also saved a bunch of the cool full-page advertisements that LIFE used to run in their issues in the '50s and '60s)....
DVP's JFK Archives/Life With John F. Kennedy
David Von Pein
June 6, 2023
================================
BILL BROWN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
You're ohhhhhhh so right here, Bill.
I get so tired of hearing CTers confront me with that tired old canard/myth/red herring, in which the CTer is trying to tell me that the ONLY reason the police went to the Texas Theater on November 22nd was because somebody didn't pay for a theater ticket. I just want to strangle the person who has the gall to say that to me (such as the CTer I was talking to in this 2016 discussion).
David Von Pein
June 7, 2023
================================
GIL JESUS SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I think that the assassination would almost certainly have not occurred had Marina and Lee agreed to get back together on November 21st. And Vincent Bugliosi thought so too. Listen:
More on this topic HERE.
ALLEN LOWE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Can I expect to see seven FBI agents at my door any minute with a warrant for my arrest?
And then there's that bombshell book I can look forward to seeing on the newsstands later this year --- "Colonel Sanders, DVP, And The Murder Of JFK: From Kentucky, To Indiana, To A Tragedy
In Texas" [Simon & Schuster; Hardcover; 788 pages; $24.95 USD].
(Yes, I think you'd better try to work The Colonel into your plot too, Allen. It'll be much better for your book sales. Because I don't have any name recognition.)
David Von Pein
June 8, 2023
================================
BENJAMIN COLE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Virtually ALL lone-assassin supporters posit that very thing [i.e., that after being shot, John Connally turned around in his jump seat to look at JFK], including the Warren Commission. And that's because Connally has obviously been shot by the time he completely turns around to stare into JFK's face. Only selected CTers believe otherwise.
SANDY LARSEN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I didn't "make" this Zapruder Film clip. I got it off the Internet many years ago.
If there's a frame missing in that Z-Film clip [also seen below], I was completely unaware of it (until now [June 9, 2023]).
SANDY LARSEN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
No. Both victims are jerking their right hands upward at exactly the same moment at Z226 (see the next clip below). Ergo, they are "REACTING" at the exact same time.
Also -- Even if Z227 is missing from the previous clip [as Sandy Larsen has alleged], that would certainly not debunk the "Connally Arm Jerk" which begins at precisely Z226 (as this two-frame clip amply illustrates):
Plus....Connally, at Z225, is clearly also reacting in different ways to having just been hit by a bullet --- his mouth opens, a discernible grimace comes across his face (IMO), his eyes close, his shoulders jerk upward in a reflex action (a very typical "startle" type of response), and there's also the lapel/tie movement at Z224/225. The clip below ends at Z225:
SANDY LARSEN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The HSCA was wrong. Their ridiculously early Z190 timing for the SBT is....well, as I just said....ridiculous.
If JFK had been hit in the back by a bullet as early as Z190, it is inconceivable that we would see his hands AS LOW as they are in Z224 and Z225:
And, btw, when watching the above Z224-Z225 Z-Film clip a few times in a row, a good argument can be made for Kennedy actually LOWERING his right hand a little bit between those two frames, which only further tends to discredit the HSCA's absurdly early Z190 timeline for the SBT shot.
SANDY LARSEN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Well, Sandy, since you're an anti-SBT conspiracy theorist, naturally I wouldn't expect you to believe that all (or any) of that Connally shoulder-flinching and lapel-bulging and eye-closing and mouth-opening and grimacing and arm-jerking (one frame later at Z226) had anything whatsoever to do with the bullet that even you know did strike Governor Connally's body at just about the exact same time in Dealey Plaza.
All of that "jerky" kind of stuff we see happening with Mr. Connally between Z225 and approx. Z230 is probably just a fantastic coincidence of some kind. But none of those reactions can possibly be related to the bullet that hit him in the back that day. Right, Sandy?
SANDY LARSEN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Oh brother!
And the incredible SBT Denial continues unabated!
Congratulations, Sandy, on continuing that rich tradition.
SANDY LARSEN THEN EDITED HIS PREVIOUS POST, TOTALLY DELETING THESE COMMENTS AND REPLACING THEM WITH THIS POST.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I'm glad I was able to screen capture the original version of Sandy Larsen's last post, before he decided to completely delete/change those comments to something else almost as equally absurd.
GERRY DOWN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Gerry,
To answer your question, the Connally "Lapel Flip" was first noticed/"discovered" in 1975 (see this 3-page excerpt from Vincent Bugliosi's book).
Lots more "SBT" debate HERE.
SOME OFF-TOPIC FOOD FUN....
DAVID G. HEALY SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Try telling that to all these people in Austin, Texas, in 1960. Or do you think all these customers were buying the "hamburgers" also being advertised?
Click To Enlarge....
SEAN COLEMAN SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Yes indeedy!
Just look at the low prices in these KFC ads from the 1950s and 1960s.
I was looking just today [June 11, 2023] at what the local KFC in my town is currently charging for some of their menu items, and it's almost obscene. If you can believe it, a bucket of 16 pieces of chicken (chicken only, mind you, with no sides included), costs $48.99 -- plus tax of course! (I kid you not.)
(Did anybody faint yet? I almost did when I saw that price.)
I'm sure glad I retired from the KFC food service industry before such outrageous prices hit the menus. I remember being quite embarrassed to tell people at the drive-thru that their family meal would cost them $25 or so back in the 1990s. Today, a full family meal can easily set you back a hundred bucks. It's unreal.
But let's now go back to a time (in early 1966) when you didn't need to mortgage the homestead AND sell the car just in order to enjoy a good meal with the Colonel.... 😁
Click for a bigger view....
-Jan-16-1966%20(KFC%20Ad).jpg)
David Von Pein
June 8-11, 2023
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DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I always enjoy it immensely when I am able to dig up a "new" JFK-related audio or video recording that I had not heard or seen before.
Such was my good fortune on June 16th, 2023, when I came across the WRUL shortwave radio broadcast from November 22, 1963, linked below.
WRUL (for "World Radio University Listeners") was a shortwave radio station in Massachusetts. In 1966, the call letters of the station were changed to WNYW (for "New York Worldwide").
This rare 11/22/63 audio was provided by Todd Kosovich and Tom Gavaras (via Archive.org). Many thanks to those two gentlemen. ....
(11-22-63)(Thumbnail).jpg)
David Von Pein
June 19, 2023
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MICHAEL GRIFFITH SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
If Oswald was really telling the truth to the police about his lunch, then you've got to wonder why Oswald told Buell Frazier that he was going to buy his lunch that day.
Frazier specifically remembers Lee having NO LUNCH BAG with him at all on 11/22/63 and Frazier also specifically remembered Oswald saying he was going to buy his lunch that day (see the testimony below).
---------------------
BUELL WESLEY FRAZIER -- "When he [LHO] rode with me, I say he always brought lunch except that one day on November 22. He didn't bring his lunch that day."
[Later....]
JOE BALL -- "Did you notice whether or not Lee had a package that looked like a lunch package that morning?"
MR. FRAZIER -- "You know like I told you earlier, I say, he didn't take his lunch because I remember right when I got in the car I asked him where was his lunch and he said he was going to buy his lunch that day."
https://jfk-assassination.net/russ/Buell Frazier's WC Testimony
---------------------
Do conspiracy believers really think Buell Frazier was the one who was lying about Lee Oswald's lunch?
Also see --- http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/#The-Paper-Bag
CORY SANTOS SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
You're surely not placing an ounce of faith in the statements of Carolyn Arnold....are you Cory? If so, I think you should re-evaluate your position.
And other than Carolyn Arnold, who else do you have that said they saw Oswald actually eating on 11/22?
CORY SANTOS SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Re: Buell Frazier saying he thought shots came from the area of the Triple Underpass....
He, like many other witnesses, was simply incorrect about this. He was fooled by the acoustics that existed in Dealey Plaza.
CORY SANTOS SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Well, yeah, I guess you're right. Perhaps the words that Buell Frazier said that Oswald uttered to him on the morning of Nov. 22 ("I'm going to buy my lunch today") could have become completely distorted by the acoustics of the nearby carport or by some other freak occurrence, which made Oswald's actual comment ("I've got my cheese and apple lunch in this huge paper bag, Wesley") only falsely sound like "I'm gonna buy my lunch" to Buell Wesley Frazier's ears.
Not a very likely error for Buell to make. But, hey, anything's possible, right? 😃
MATT ALLISON SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I don't see any reason to assume the rifle was "in pieces" when it was transported to and from New Orleans in the spring and summer of 1963.
Why would anyone assume such a thing?
I don't know how the rifle was specifically packed for transit. Nobody does. But I can reasonably infer that Oswald's C2766 Carcano rifle WAS transported (in some manner) to and from New Orleans in 1963.
CORY SANTOS SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
It doesn't matter one bit whether Oswald ate lunch or not on 11/22. Oswald's still guilty (the overall evidence proves that fact many times over)---with or without a lunch in his stomach.
As I said earlier....
"Now, I suppose we can speculate that Oswald DID, indeed, buy his lunch from the catering truck that morning and then ate it sometime before 12:30. But even if that did occur, it certainly would not exonerate Oswald for the President's murder in any way at all."
David Von Pein
June 19-21, 2023
================================
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Reality Break (Re: The CE573 Walker Bullet)....
The fact that CE573 cannot be linked to any specific rifle is virtual proof, right there, that it was not "planted" into the evidence pile. Because only a total idiot would want to do something so stupid. Although, yes, CE573 looks exactly like CE399 in many respects. No doubt about it. But if you're going to go to the trouble of PLANTING a bullet to frame a particular person, you're surely going to make sure that that bullet can be tied exclusively to the patsy's gun.
BENJAMIN COLE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
CE573 (just like CE399) is a Full METAL Jacketed (FMJ) bullet.
And....
Steel = Metal.
Copper = Metal.
And....
"Some individuals commonly refer to rifle bullets as steel-jacketed bullets, when they actually in fact just have a copper alloy jacket." -- Robert A. Frazier of the FBI (3 H 439)
Conspiracy theorists always make way way too much out of the "Steel" reference when it comes to CE573. They just can't fathom that Robert A. Frazier was right about what he said to the Warren Commission in the testimony I just quoted above.
BENJAMIN COLE SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Ben,
Bob Frazier was a firearms expert for the Federal Bureau of Investigation. I would think that his word just might mean a little something when it comes to the subject of bullets. But most CTers (naturally) just want to toss aside everything he said.
But even with the "Steel/Copper" controversy staring us in the face every day, Lee Harvey Oswald's guilt in the Walker shooting has been proven beyond all reasonable doubt in multiple other non-ballistic ways, such as in Commission Exhibit No. 1.
Am I really supposed to believe that one of the following two things is true regarding Commission Exhibit No. 1?....
1. The cops (or Feds) faked Lee Oswald's handwriting in CE1.
Or:
2. Oswald was really referring to something totally unrelated to the Walker shooting in the note he wrote to Marina (which became CE1).
And then there's Marina's own testimony about Lee himself confessing to having shot at Walker:
"He [Lee] told me that he had shot at General Walker." -- Marina Oswald (1 H 16)
More lies, Ben?
Question:
At what point does the evidence connected to the JFK and Tippit murder cases and the Walker shooting become something that can be utilized to actually try to solve those three crimes, versus the evidence being something that conspiracy theorists try their best to explain away, in their constant efforts to exonerate a certain Mr. Oswald?
LAWRENCE SCHNAPF SAID THIS.
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
The proverbial "I don't trust a single word the FBI said about the evidence" gambit is the typical silly approach that many (or most) conspiracy theorists have adopted over the years. And it's the thing that enables many CTers to just make up any assassination scenario they want to -- despite their complete lack of actual evidence to support any of their beliefs.
David Von Pein
June 19-20, 2023
================================
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
I really enjoyed watching and listening to the Sixth Floor Museum's 2016 Oral History interview with Dr. Cyril Wecht (linked below).
As you might have guessed, I totally disagree with Cyril's pro-conspiracy slant on the JFK assassination, but even so, it's nearly impossible not to personally like Dr. Wecht. His enthusiasm and passion when he discusses the John Kennedy murder case, even after all these years of talking about it over and over again, are things I can't help but admire. And keep in mind, Cyril was 85 years old at the time of this interview! And his mind is still as sharp as they come. (He's 92 as of the date of this post [June 22, 2023], and still going strong.)
This interview is 82 minutes long....of which Dr. Wecht is speaking for about 80 of those minutes (maybe even more). No kidding. But that's not too surprising to me, because I know Cyril loves to talk. And, boy, he sure does a lot of that here. But even a dedicated "LNer" like myself (of all people) thoroughly enjoyed this interview....
Custom logo by DVP; the "bursting" passion courtesy of Dr. Cyril Harrison Wecht of Pittsburgh:
David Von Pein
June 22, 2023
================================
DAVID VON PEIN SAID:
Here's some information I've just added to my WTIC-Radio (Hartford, Connecticut) webpages concerning WTIC's coverage on the day of JFK's assassination. The text that I captured in the image below was written in 2013 by Doug Bertel, son of WTIC newsman Dick Bertel. Click for a bigger view:
David Von Pein
June 24, 2023
